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  1. #26
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    Re: Naruto as Jinchuuriki - Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Whiteknight View Post
    So, my questions are these: Why wasn't Naruto trained to be a weapon like almost all other Jinchuuriki were? Why wasn't he told about the Fox and taught how to control it? Why didn't the 3rd Hokage play more of a role in helping him to get trained, like other kages in other villages did with their jinchuuriki? Why did the hidden leaf village seem to know so little about how to control the tailed beast and how to use its power? It seems like Naruto has had to learn a lot of this stuff on his own, which doesn't make sense if he is a weapon and an important deterrent for war.
    Let's see if this helps...
    >Naruto wasn't trained...most likely because no one would train him. For example, someone kills your parents. Then you find out that that person may be your only hope, but ONLY if you can teach him the alphabet. Most people would say "screw that."
    >He knew why people hated him, it says it in the first episode (and also in Kishimoto-sempai's Pilot manga for Naruto).
    >The 3rd was way to kind, I mean, you saw what he did for Sasuke. Think about it...where was Naruto's way of living coming from? (i.e. how could he afford a place to live? I'm pretty sure there are homeless people in Konohagakure) The Third didn't want him to be considered a weapon (but rather a hero...which he would later become)-especially because of what Minato and Kushina died for.
    >The only people who knew about the process of sealing the Tailed Beast were dead, dying, or would be dying soon at the time (ie Minato and Kushina...and the third hokage's wife). The lay people of the village were too afraid of Naruto to care about him later on.
    >Also, keep in mind that the other villages didn't know who the 9-tails jinchuuriki was. All they knew was that Konohagakure still had one.

    Hope that helped.
    -ukoono4
     
         

  2. #27
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    Re: Naruto as Jinchuuriki - Questions

    Comparing the hidden leaf to Sand village, the 3rd hokage never rely on the jinchuuriki's power to protect the village as you can see they rely on their strong ninjas. He protected Naruto so he'll never knew the 9 tails who attacked the village has been sealed inside him while the Gaara's dad trust the power of the jinchuuriki and sacrificed his youngest son to maintain the so called secret weapon of their village.
    I think the reason why the 3rd did not play the role of training Naruto as a jinchuuriki because Naruto is still too young to be trained, he should undergo training like the other newbies should do but he did assigned kakashi, since Kakashi knew something about the jinchuuriki and know a lot about Naruto.
    No one knows before why Minato sealed the 9 tails inside his new born son but the 3rd did his best to give Naruto a happy life and protecting him despite people treating him badly, its the only thing the 3rd could do after the 4th sacrificed his life for the village.
     
         

  3. #28
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    Re: Naruto as Jinchuuriki - Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Whiteknight View Post
    This is going back a little bit. I was re-reading some of the old manga back from before the time skip and I have a few questions about things. A couple bits of the story aren't adding up, and I'm wondering if it's just a mistake from the Manga or if I am missing something.

    Tl;DR, here's the short version: Jinchuuriki are important weapons for the village, and other villages train Jinchuuriki for that purpose. Naruto didn't know the fox was inside him, didn't know how to use it, wasn't trained how to control it, and wasn't treated like a weapon by the village. Instead, he was ignored and avoided, a strategy that would most likely have turned him into a monster and a criminal. The hidden leaf, despite having the most experience with tailed beasts, didn't know how to train Naruto to control the Fox, and was doing a terrible job.

    We know that Jinchuuriki from most villages are considered weapons or deterrents. Gaara, for example, was given the 1-tails as a baby because the Kazekage wanted him to become a weapon for the village. Same with the hidden cloud village, where Bee was given the 8-tails to be a weapon for the village. Similar stories are told about some of the other Jinchuuriki as well: Most of them are treated as weapons. In the hidden cloud village, we know that this was common, that the sidekick of the raikage was usually a specially-selected jinchuuriki. But in the Leaf village Mito and Kushina were selected as Jinchuuriki because they had seals and special chakra to suppress the fox, not because they were great ninja or were going to be weapons. They were vessels, not weapons.

    If there is a war, it would seem like the jinchuuriki would have played a big part of it. Maybe the leaf village didn't need to use the Fox as a weapon, because any powerful Uchiha would have been able to suppress the jinchuuriki from other villages (We see Madara and pre-MS sasuke both be able to do this, so other Uchiha might be able to also). However, after the massacre of the Uchiha, the Leaf village wouldn't have had that advantage. It would have been more important to train a powerful jinchuuriki, not less important. Naruto would have become the most important weapon in the village, and a big part of their war plans and defense strategy.

    And if the Mito and Kushina were used as weapons, why wasn't Naruto? He didn't even know the Fox was inside him until the beginning of the Manga. He accidentally unlocked the power on the bridge during the fight with Zabuza, and he didn't learn to use the power on demand until his training with Jiraya during the Chinuun exams. Gaara already seemed to be very familiar with the 1-tails during the Chinuun exams, but Naruto didn't even learn the basics until the month before the finals. If Jinchuuriki are so powerful and so important, and are used as strategic weapons by the villages, why didn't Naruto learn about it earlier, and why wasn't he trained to use it better as a matter of national security? During the final match between Naruto and Neji, the 3rd Hokage was surprised to see that Naruto was able to use the power at all, so it clearly wasn't part of the plan. You would think that the Hokage would play an active role in Naruto's development, training him to control and use the power of the fox, and help build him into a powerful weapon for the village. Instead, it seemed like the plan was for everybody to ignore Naruto and avoid him. As Naruto himself says, he could have grown up into a monster like Gaara was becoming, because of the way he was ignored and avoided. In the Hidden cloud Village, Bee was treated as a hero, and a sidekick to the Raikage when he was still young.

    Another question I have is why Nobody in the hidden leaf village seemed to know anything about training a Jinchuuriki or how to control the power of the tailed beast. If Hashirama used to own several of the tailed beasts, and if the hidden leaf had been using and training Mito and Kushina as jinchuuriki weapons, why didn't the hidden leaf ninjas know how to train Naruto to control the fox? Why did Naruto have to learn these things from Bee in the hidden cloud? Maybe all the people who knew these secrets died. Kushina died before she could have shared the secrets of training with other jinchuuriki. The 4th hokage also died early. But, that doesn't explain why Jiraya couldn't have taught some more of the details to Naruto, unless Jiraya didn't know it either. Also, I find it hard to believe that Tsunade didn't know how to do it if she was related to Mito and knew Kushina. Plus, as Hokage, Tsunade would have had access to hidden and forbidden written records from the first and second hokages about the topic. Even after the death of Jiraya, she didn't play any role in helping to train Naruto, even though she didn't have much time to do it.

    If most of the tailed beasts were owned by Hashirama in the past, then the Hidden Leaf village with Hashirama's experience should have been the most knowledgable, but they weren't. Other villages had much more experience with the beasts. The hidden sand village and the hidden cloud village both had methods for determining host compatibility, and both of those villages experimented with using multiple hosts to create weapons. The hidden rain and hidden stone villages had multiple jinchuuriki each as well, and intended for their jinchuuriki to be used as weapons too.

    So, my questions are these: Why wasn't Naruto trained to be a weapon like almost all other Jinchuuriki were? Why wasn't he told about the Fox and taught how to control it? Why didn't the 3rd Hokage play more of a role in helping him to get trained, like other kages in other villages did with their jinchuuriki? Why did the hidden leaf village seem to know so little about how to control the tailed beast and how to use its power? It seems like Naruto has had to learn a lot of this stuff on his own, which doesn't make sense if he is a weapon and an important deterrent for war.
    In short naruto wasnt really focused on. Jiraiya made it clear to kahashi it handle naruto's training. And lets face no one else in konoha could have.

    But intresting enough even jiraiya inaitally felt abit gullty in trying to allow naruto aceess the fox in limited ways. He thought Minato's reasons where not to be used and just be housed like in kushina's case.

    But later on jiraiya suspected Madara was behind the fox attack and then duced minato wanted naruto to use this power. And he was right a sminato himself confirmed this.

    So basiclly naruto's development was slowed down because there seem to be confusion what the purpose and last wishes minato intended for Naruto. And this understandable, as the previous hosts like kushina were merely containing the beast or that what it seemed to me. Which probaly means that konoha inthe past didnt need mitary power support from te fox and this makes sense each hokage and firends were BS in most generations.

    Also what added to this was minato's battle with madara was sudden and suriprise and when the third hokage came help minato he came at the point where he was about to seal the fox with the death god. So minato never had a chance to tell the third hokage that madara is ready for damage and I want naruto to use the fox as u will need "unque skillsets"(minato's words) to take on madara.

    I hope that helped, this to me was the reason why naruto position in the village wasnt really understood.
     
         

  4. #29
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    Re: Naruto as Jinchuuriki - Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Whiteknight View Post
    This is going back a little bit. I was re-reading some of the old manga back from before the time skip and I have a few questions about things. A couple bits of the story aren't adding up, and I'm wondering if it's just a mistake from the Manga or if I am missing something.

    Tl;DR, here's the short version: Jinchuuriki are important weapons for the village, and other villages train Jinchuuriki for that purpose. Naruto didn't know the fox was inside him, didn't know how to use it, wasn't trained how to control it, and wasn't treated like a weapon by the village. Instead, he was ignored and avoided, a strategy that would most likely have turned him into a monster and a criminal. The hidden leaf, despite having the most experience with tailed beasts, didn't know how to train Naruto to control the Fox, and was doing a terrible job.

    We know that Jinchuuriki from most villages are considered weapons or deterrents. Gaara, for example, was given the 1-tails as a baby because the Kazekage wanted him to become a weapon for the village. Same with the hidden cloud village, where Bee was given the 8-tails to be a weapon for the village. Similar stories are told about some of the other Jinchuuriki as well: Most of them are treated as weapons. In the hidden cloud village, we know that this was common, that the sidekick of the raikage was usually a specially-selected jinchuuriki. But in the Leaf village Mito and Kushina were selected as Jinchuuriki because they had seals and special chakra to suppress the fox, not because they were great ninja or were going to be weapons. They were vessels, not weapons.

    If there is a war, it would seem like the jinchuuriki would have played a big part of it. Maybe the leaf village didn't need to use the Fox as a weapon, because any powerful Uchiha would have been able to suppress the jinchuuriki from other villages (We see Madara and pre-MS sasuke both be able to do this, so other Uchiha might be able to also). However, after the massacre of the Uchiha, the Leaf village wouldn't have had that advantage. It would have been more important to train a powerful jinchuuriki, not less important. Naruto would have become the most important weapon in the village, and a big part of their war plans and defense strategy.

    And if the Mito and Kushina were used as weapons, why wasn't Naruto? He didn't even know the Fox was inside him until the beginning of the Manga. He accidentally unlocked the power on the bridge during the fight with Zabuza, and he didn't learn to use the power on demand until his training with Jiraya during the Chinuun exams. Gaara already seemed to be very familiar with the 1-tails during the Chinuun exams, but Naruto didn't even learn the basics until the month before the finals. If Jinchuuriki are so powerful and so important, and are used as strategic weapons by the villages, why didn't Naruto learn about it earlier, and why wasn't he trained to use it better as a matter of national security? During the final match between Naruto and Neji, the 3rd Hokage was surprised to see that Naruto was able to use the power at all, so it clearly wasn't part of the plan. You would think that the Hokage would play an active role in Naruto's development, training him to control and use the power of the fox, and help build him into a powerful weapon for the village. Instead, it seemed like the plan was for everybody to ignore Naruto and avoid him. As Naruto himself says, he could have grown up into a monster like Gaara was becoming, because of the way he was ignored and avoided. In the Hidden cloud Village, Bee was treated as a hero, and a sidekick to the Raikage when he was still young.

    Another question I have is why Nobody in the hidden leaf village seemed to know anything about training a Jinchuuriki or how to control the power of the tailed beast. If Hashirama used to own several of the tailed beasts, and if the hidden leaf had been using and training Mito and Kushina as jinchuuriki weapons, why didn't the hidden leaf ninjas know how to train Naruto to control the fox? Why did Naruto have to learn these things from Bee in the hidden cloud? Maybe all the people who knew these secrets died. Kushina died before she could have shared the secrets of training with other jinchuuriki. The 4th hokage also died early. But, that doesn't explain why Jiraya couldn't have taught some more of the details to Naruto, unless Jiraya didn't know it either. Also, I find it hard to believe that Tsunade didn't know how to do it if she was related to Mito and knew Kushina. Plus, as Hokage, Tsunade would have had access to hidden and forbidden written records from the first and second hokages about the topic. Even after the death of Jiraya, she didn't play any role in helping to train Naruto, even though she didn't have much time to do it.

    If most of the tailed beasts were owned by Hashirama in the past, then the Hidden Leaf village with Hashirama's experience should have been the most knowledgable, but they weren't. Other villages had much more experience with the beasts. The hidden sand village and the hidden cloud village both had methods for determining host compatibility, and both of those villages experimented with using multiple hosts to create weapons. The hidden rain and hidden stone villages had multiple jinchuuriki each as well, and intended for their jinchuuriki to be used as weapons too.

    So, my questions are these: Why wasn't Naruto trained to be a weapon like almost all other Jinchuuriki were? Why wasn't he told about the Fox and taught how to control it? Why didn't the 3rd Hokage play more of a role in helping him to get trained, like other kages in other villages did with their jinchuuriki? Why did the hidden leaf village seem to know so little about how to control the tailed beast and how to use its power? It seems like Naruto has had to learn a lot of this stuff on his own, which doesn't make sense if he is a weapon and an important deterrent for war.
    Lets see:
    1) The only perfect jinchuuriki was Bee at the time. I would doubt they would share how he and A was able to control the Hachibi. There land also had sacred places that aided a jinchuuriki which was that waterfall and that temple thingy.
    -Konoha has none of the above places.
    -Konoha did not actually "control" the tailed beasts. It was forced by the Shodaime. Bee and Naruto atm actually had to put some work into gaining control of their tailed beasts.
    -He lost his parents to the fox, he was young, no one knew who he was the son of. Don't you think informing him about the Kyuubi would have further ruined his childhood?

    2) The only perfect host back then was Bee. What makes you say only Konoha lacked knowledge on how to control tailed beasts? Also, Naruto is not a perfect host atm either.

    3) Naruto did not learn to control the fox. He had help from Kushina and Bee. Naruto was only able to steal the fox's chakra, not control it.

    4) Hiruzen was peace loving. He never saw Naruto as a weapon. The other villages would try to control their tailed beasts because:
    -Their beasts would take over and cause damage and deaths, as shown through the Shukaku and the Hachibi.
    -Hence, the continual need for a better host.

    Naruto is an Uzumaki. As shown through Mito and Kushina, they have no problems with the fox sealed within.
     
         

  5. #30
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    Re: Naruto as Jinchuuriki - Questions

    The fourth was his 'Daddy Dearest'. The Third was a kind old man. These two had probably given out explicit orders not to let anything happen to Naruto (Mentally, Physically, Emotionally, etc).
     
         

  6. #31
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    Re: Naruto as Jinchuuriki - Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Whiteknight View Post
    This is going back a little bit. I was re-reading some of the old manga back from before the time skip and I have a few questions about things. A couple bits of the story aren't adding up, and I'm wondering if it's just a mistake from the Manga or if I am missing something.

    Tl;DR, here's the short version: Jinchuuriki are important weapons for the village, and other villages train Jinchuuriki for that purpose. Naruto didn't know the fox was inside him, didn't know how to use it, wasn't trained how to control it, and wasn't treated like a weapon by the village. Instead, he was ignored and avoided, a strategy that would most likely have turned him into a monster and a criminal. The hidden leaf, despite having the most experience with tailed beasts, didn't know how to train Naruto to control the Fox, and was doing a terrible job.

    We know that Jinchuuriki from most villages are considered weapons or deterrents. Gaara, for example, was given the 1-tails as a baby because the Kazekage wanted him to become a weapon for the village. Same with the hidden cloud village, where Bee was given the 8-tails to be a weapon for the village. Similar stories are told about some of the other Jinchuuriki as well: Most of them are treated as weapons. In the hidden cloud village, we know that this was common, that the sidekick of the raikage was usually a specially-selected jinchuuriki. But in the Leaf village Mito and Kushina were selected as Jinchuuriki because they had seals and special chakra to suppress the fox, not because they were great ninja or were going to be weapons. They were vessels, not weapons.

    If there is a war, it would seem like the jinchuuriki would have played a big part of it. Maybe the leaf village didn't need to use the Fox as a weapon, because any powerful Uchiha would have been able to suppress the jinchuuriki from other villages (We see Madara and pre-MS sasuke both be able to do this, so other Uchiha might be able to also). However, after the massacre of the Uchiha, the Leaf village wouldn't have had that advantage. It would have been more important to train a powerful jinchuuriki, not less important. Naruto would have become the most important weapon in the village, and a big part of their war plans and defense strategy.

    And if the Mito and Kushina were used as weapons, why wasn't Naruto? He didn't even know the Fox was inside him until the beginning of the Manga. He accidentally unlocked the power on the bridge during the fight with Zabuza, and he didn't learn to use the power on demand until his training with Jiraya during the Chinuun exams. Gaara already seemed to be very familiar with the 1-tails during the Chinuun exams, but Naruto didn't even learn the basics until the month before the finals. If Jinchuuriki are so powerful and so important, and are used as strategic weapons by the villages, why didn't Naruto learn about it earlier, and why wasn't he trained to use it better as a matter of national security? During the final match between Naruto and Neji, the 3rd Hokage was surprised to see that Naruto was able to use the power at all, so it clearly wasn't part of the plan. You would think that the Hokage would play an active role in Naruto's development, training him to control and use the power of the fox, and help build him into a powerful weapon for the village. Instead, it seemed like the plan was for everybody to ignore Naruto and avoid him. As Naruto himself says, he could have grown up into a monster like Gaara was becoming, because of the way he was ignored and avoided. In the Hidden cloud Village, Bee was treated as a hero, and a sidekick to the Raikage when he was still young.

    Another question I have is why Nobody in the hidden leaf village seemed to know anything about training a Jinchuuriki or how to control the power of the tailed beast. If Hashirama used to own several of the tailed beasts, and if the hidden leaf had been using and training Mito and Kushina as jinchuuriki weapons, why didn't the hidden leaf ninjas know how to train Naruto to control the fox? Why did Naruto have to learn these things from Bee in the hidden cloud? Maybe all the people who knew these secrets died. Kushina died before she could have shared the secrets of training with other jinchuuriki. The 4th hokage also died early. But, that doesn't explain why Jiraya couldn't have taught some more of the details to Naruto, unless Jiraya didn't know it either. Also, I find it hard to believe that Tsunade didn't know how to do it if she was related to Mito and knew Kushina. Plus, as Hokage, Tsunade would have had access to hidden and forbidden written records from the first and second hokages about the topic. Even after the death of Jiraya, she didn't play any role in helping to train Naruto, even though she didn't have much time to do it.

    If most of the tailed beasts were owned by Hashirama in the past, then the Hidden Leaf village with Hashirama's experience should have been the most knowledgable, but they weren't. Other villages had much more experience with the beasts. The hidden sand village and the hidden cloud village both had methods for determining host compatibility, and both of those villages experimented with using multiple hosts to create weapons. The hidden rain and hidden stone villages had multiple jinchuuriki each as well, and intended for their jinchuuriki to be used as weapons too.

    So, my questions are these: Why wasn't Naruto trained to be a weapon like almost all other Jinchuuriki were? Why wasn't he told about the Fox and taught how to control it? Why didn't the 3rd Hokage play more of a role in helping him to get trained, like other kages in other villages did with their jinchuuriki? Why did the hidden leaf village seem to know so little about how to control the tailed beast and how to use its power? It seems like Naruto has had to learn a lot of this stuff on his own, which doesn't make sense if he is a weapon and an important deterrent for war.
    I wonder about this all the time. u always get useless answers from people like "the village blames the 9 tails for the death of the 4th hokage", which doesnt answer why he wasnt trained.

    The only reason i can think up is that they were scared the 9 tails would be too powerful and evil to control. It is the strongest of them, so that could be a possibility.
     
         

  7. #32
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    Re: Naruto as Jinchuuriki - Questions

    One thing you guys have to realize is that you guys give too much personality to the Third Hokage and the citizens of Konoha. You have to remember that things are WRITTEN to be a certain way.

    Naruto is a character in a story. Him being hated gave him a drive to learn everything up until Sage Mode, him being Kage level at the time. Him striving to fight Sasuke was what allowed him to subjugate the Kyuubi, which enhanced him even further.

    It's just plot. Kishimoto probably reads these threads and is thinking "I wasn't even thinking about all that".

    Kishimoto is a human, who forgets to put things down. I don't worship him like a God, nor do I think the OP does. But many here go as far as to put SCIENCE into ninjutsu, or SCIENCE in the Naruto world in general. I am aware of the science used in SOME elements of Naruto, but we forget that this is a world that was CREATED by a human.

    Your question was well thought out and great. If Kishimoto DID plan out the thing where Jinchuuriki were to be used as weapons, I would say that the Third, being peaceful, just wanted Naruto to try to live as normally as possible. He never hated Naruto, but he was likely too busy being a Kage to play an active role in Naruto's life.
     
         

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