Face the Damn Facts!

[★Waltz]

I just had to address these commonly mis-understood/annoying concepts.
---------------------------
Naruto Vs Sasuke

As i've stated before:

Naruto fans will say: Naruto
Sasuke Fans will say: Sasuke
Plot shiled users will say: Kishi says their equal
Intelligent memebers will say: Sasuke hasen't displayed enough Raw power and techniques to defeat naruto currently.

Both PS users and Int Members are correct, but Kishimoto cannot prove his statement via the manga, therefore its a contradictory statement.

Therefore Naruto wins.
-----------------------
Fact vs Saying

To sensible members this must be the most annoying thing that can happen in a good discussion.
For example, Many members say...and note the word "said/spoke/spoken":

"Raikage said that No one surpassed Minato, therefore Minato > A"
"Madara said that only Hashirama could stop him, therefore Hashirama > Madara"

These stupid members take "Saying" over "Fact" . They do not come to a judgement based on Feats, but based on some Technically untrue statement. We find the biggest flaws when it comes to this during the Kabuto vs Uchiha bros.

"Kabuto said he was the clostest during the fight to the sage, Therefore Kabuto should be > Any current ninja alive"but yet still he was defeated by an Uchiha.

(Plese note that sasuke had nothing to do with this fight...Itachi planned to go by himself from the very beginning. Meeting sasuke was an inevitable mishap).
---------------
Nagato's Rinnegan Usage > Madara's Rinnegan Usage

Madara has used Human Path
Madara has used Preta Path
Madara could only know that The Rinnegan could use Rinne Tensei (the final path), if he's Mastered it.

This leave's their mastery equal.

Madara has the advantage...he can summon Meteorites. Something Nagato has not shown the ability to do.
--------------

Muu > Hashirama

Flight+Invisibility+Jinton > Hashirama + Healing Factor.

Hashirama was not a sensor and has nothing on flight. Jinton has proven to slich through Mokuton like butter. Mu used Severl Jinton attacks during his fight with onooki...Hashi wouldn't survive. Mu takes this High diff.

-------------
SM Naruto Surpassed Minato.

This is one of the things in the manga i could presume to be a lie.
Minato's Feats (though all weren't shown) could easily defeat SM Naruto in a fight.

------------
EMS sasuke > Orochimaru.

False...more so pending:

We know that Orochimaru knew Many forbidden jutsu..and most of which we have yet to see. He is the most durable character in the series having survived Tsukyomi, Amaterasu, Totsuka with ease.

Orochimaru was observing from within anko throughout the war...He knows sasuke has EMS, and has seen it in action yet he makes this statement:



"I don't have enough power to steal it yet"

This ^ implies that he is confident that he is capable of surpassing EMS sasuke and most likely will in future chapters.
------------------

Minato Fodders Kakashi

Debatable.
Kakashi's one of the smartest fighters in naruto...his intelligence and use of shadow clones would make a great difference in this fight. The duration that kakashi can use Kamui before exhausting almost equals with Minato's usage of FTG. Kakashi knows minato's fighting style and tricks. Kakashi/Minato takes this high diff.

[BlkMagk]

Well Said

[ziggyZ]

True.

[xjimbox]

Yelp pretty much

[★Waltz]

theres no reason to be mad.

everyone has opinions, so please dont waste your time trying to convince them.

True but Why should anyone accept absurd opinions and not address the matter if you know its poor logic?

[muutobirama3rdraikagemizu]

who beat naruto twice sasuke you cant just say naruto > everyone because of plot kishi could just let naruto die and have a time skip and konohomoru be the main character :l

[~Dream~]

I disagree with everything except for Naruto > Sasuke.

[Ldude]

True but Why should anyone accept absurd opinions and not address the matter if you know its poor logic?

It's not poor logic. Both sides have valid arguments. :shrug:

[EpicBoss HD]

Thank you....now where is all the damn Sasuke fans lol?

[★Waltz]

who beat naruto twice sasuke you cant just say naruto > everyone because of plot kishi could just let naruto die and have a time skip and konohomoru be the main character :l

Sasuke never defeated Naruto at the waterfall or at the beginning of shippuden. kishi Could, but he wouldn't do something like that.
Naruto is infact > Sasuke currently.

I disagree with everything except for Naruto > Sasuke.

you tend to disagree with most things i say.

[Cursed Prince]

EMS Sasuke greater than Oro. Other than that I can peacfully agree

[Scrafty]

That means Mu > Madara since Mu > Hashirama, right?

[Cobra73]

Agreed

[LordRevan]

I just had to address these commonly mis-understood/annoying concepts.
---------------------------
Naruto Vs Sasuke

As i've stated before:

Naruto fans will say: Naruto
Sasuke Fans will say: Sasuke
Plot shiled users will say: Kishi says their equal
Intelligent memebers will say: Sasuke hasen't displayed enough Raw power and techniques to defeat naruto currently.

Both PS users and Int Members are correct, but Kishimoto cannot prove his statement via the manga, therefore its a contradictory statement.

Therefore Naruto wins.
-----------------------
Fact vs Saying

To sensible members this must be the most annoying thing that can happen in a good discussion.
For example, Many members say...and note the word "said/spoke/spoken":

"Raikage said that No one surpassed Minato, therefore Minato > A"
"Madara said that only Hashirama could stop him, therefore Hashirama > Madara"

These stupid members take "Saying" over "Fact" . They do not come to a judgement based on Feats, but based on some Technically untrue statement. We find the biggest flaws when it comes to this during the Kabuto vs Uchiha bros.

"Kabuto said he was the clostest during the fight to the sage, Therefore Kabuto should be > Any current ninja alive"but yet still he was defeated by an Uchiha.

(Plese note that sasuke had nothing to do with this fight...Itachi planned to go by himself from the very beginning. Meeting sasuke was an inevitable mishap).
---------------
Nagato's Rinnegan Usage > Madara's Rinnegan Usage

Madara has used Human Path
Madara has used Preta Path
Madara could only know that The Rinnegan could use Rinne Tensei (the final path), if he's Mastered it.

This leave's their mastery equal.

Madara has the advantage...he can summon Meteorites. Something Nagato has not shown the ability to do.
--------------

Muu > Hashirama

Flight+Invisibility+Jinton > Hashirama + Healing Factor.

Hashirama was not a sensor and has nothing on flight. Jinton has proven to slich through Mokuton like butter. Mu used Severl Jinton attacks during his fight with onooki...Hashi wouldn't survive. Mu takes this High diff.

-------------
SM Naruto Surpassed Minato.

This is one of the things in the manga i could presume to be a lie.
Minato's Feats (though all weren't shown) could easily defeat SM Naruto in a fight.

------------
EMS sasuke > Orochimaru.

False...more so pending:

We know that Orochimaru knew Many forbidden jutsu..and most of which we have yet to see. He is the most durable character in the series having survived Tsukyomi, Amaterasu, Totsuka with ease.

Orochimaru was observing from within anko throughout the war...He knows sasuke has EMS, and has seen it in action yet he makes this statement:



"I don't have enough power to steal it yet"

This ^ implies that he is confident that he is capable of surpassing EMS sasuke and most likely will in future chapters.
------------------

Minato Fodders Kakashi

Debatable.
Kakashi's one of the smartest fighters in naruto...his intelligence and use of shadow clones would make a great difference in this fight. The duration that kakashi can use Kamui before exhausting almost equals with Minato's usage of FTG. Kakashi knows minato's fighting style and tricks. Kakashi/Minato takes this high diff.

O_o...

Fact: We have seen Minato fight
Fact: we have seen Muu fight
Fact: we have seen Raikage fight
Fact: we have seen Kakashi fight
Fact: We have seen Madara fight
Fact: A person knows who is capable of defeating him and who is not.
Fact: we have not yet seen Hashirama's full power.. and from the ones we have seen he is pretty OP.. And the "sensor" can be debated.
Fact: Madara has seen all of the Hokages..
Fact: Noone has achieved Hashirama's Feats
Fact: Raikage never said "no one has surpassed Minato"....
Fact: Kabuto was still stronger then the Uchiha Bros
Fact: Saying always counts until proven wrong.

[★Waltz]

It's not poor logic. Both sides have valid arguments. :shrug:

Thats where stupidity comes in...theres a barrier.

That means Mu > Madara since Mu > Hashirama, right?

No. Poor Logic. A>B means that A>C logic does not apply to Narutoverse.

Current Madara > Muu & Hashirama.

[muutobirama3rdraikagemizu]

Sasuke never defeated Naruto at the waterfall or at the beginning of shippuden. kishi Could, but he wouldn't do something like that.
Naruto is infact > Sasuke currently.

you tend to disagree with most things i say.

fanboy answer sasuke beat him twice

[Hipster Madara]

I agree with a vast majority of this.

[~Dream~]

Guys, no need to fight.

Just

[hatake axel]

DAYUUUUM....

and that was nothing but... TRUE

[★Waltz]

Fact: Saying always counts until proven wrong.

Fact: If statement is proven false, then it is debatable.

fanboy answer sasuke beat him twice

No, Sasuke had never surpassed naruto at any point. Keep the kyuubi in mind also.

[Direcorpse]

It's not poor logic. Both sides have valid arguments. :shrug:

This.

Plus, wouldn't it be better to know that they fought on equal footing with everything they had?
Just like Vote ( except the Chidori vs Rasengan part since naruto looked lame with long ass fangs haha ), they poured what they both had and it was a bad-ass showdown!

[EpicBoss HD]

guys, no need to fight.

Just

lolololololololololol

[dominicansharingan]

GTFO with this thread

[3MESSIAH]

true.naruto wins

[muutobirama3rdraikagemizu]

Fact: If statement is proven false, then it is debatable.


No, Sasuke had never surpassed naruto at any point. Keep the kyuubi in mind also.

naruto was dead if not for kakashi he would have been dead if not for sai