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    The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    — This is dedicated to 'Toxic for finding the strength to endure in the face of bigotry, like a true shinobi, till the very end —

    Last Wednesday the first of several Presidential Debates took place in Denver CO. Only two candidates faced off against each other that night — Presidential candidate hopeful Mitt Romney & President Barack H. Obama.

    What some of you may have noticed is that there was an element missing from the debates themselves, well actually ... a few elements. The smallest element, and yet most crucial to having a debate at all, missing was that of actual debate. Both speaker seemed to be approaching each question with a attitude of holding back from actually saying what was apparent to the audience given the build up we’ve been getting the past months. This is partially, but not wholly, about how Obama had not raised his voice or interrupted the moderator to the horrendous degree that Romney did due to the stigma PoC here in America face. Clearly, Obama didn’t want to be painted as an angry & LOUD black man, which Hannity implied on his show before the debate.

    Next on our check list of missing elements was that of ‘real’ questions. Questions that are prevalent to our time —
    † the issue of nuclear stockpiles around the world.
    † the epidemic of homelessness across America and it’s causes, such as war.
    † the impending disaster that will eventually hit mankind via the current melting of permafrost and glaciers across the globe as well as other climate change effects.
    † the war on women's health.
    † gun control seems appropriate considering what’s happened in the last few years, this year & where the debate was held. [think Columbine]
    † talk of the real solutions to, and truths about, the American backed Israeli occupation of Palestine.

    Lastly, the number one thing that was missing from this debate were the three other ‘Third Party’ candidates running for the Presidency that aren’t a part of the Democratic or Republican parties, namely —
    † Dr. Jill Stein of the Green Party
    Rocky Anderson of the Justice Party [who is showing 5% in the polls]
    Gary Johnson of the Libertarian Party

    Now I’m well aware that there are to be more Presidential debates, but I fear they will be more of the same. Even if what I mentioned as material for relevant questions is brought to the podiums, we can be sure we won’t hear much in the way of answers or truth.

    But why? Why was all of this missing from what is supposed to be a stimulating and intricate part of the legislative process?

    Unfortunately, it was all planed this way. But why? By who?

    The Commission of Presidential Debates — a privet corporation funded by Anheuser-Bush, and many other corperations, and controlled by both the Democratic & Republican parties. Yes, you read right. Controlled, with a capitol C.

    Apparently the two party system the US has been dominated by for years, though seemingly against each other no matter where you look, TV, radio, online & news papers, were all the while secretly coming together to control the debates.

    Here is the [source].

    You might be thinking to yourself that it can’t be all that bad. Yes well, it is.

    Prior to 1988 the League of Women Voters were acting as moderators for the events of the Presidential Debates until it withdrew from the position leaving with this statement:

    "... the demands of the two campaign organizations would perpetrate a fraud on the American voter."

    What fraud were they talking about? After the 1988 Debates the George H.W. Bush and Michael Dukakis campaigns secretly agreed to a "memorandum of understanding" that would decide which candidates could participate in the debates, which individuals would be panelists (and therefore able to ask questions), and the height of the podiums. The League of Women Voters rejected the demands and thus the CPD was born.

    I regret to inform every one of you who was debating about who really took the ‘debate’ on Wednesday that indeed ...

    You’ve been ...
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    i hate this i dont matter who wins money everything gone be the same
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monster nagato View Post
    i hate this i dont matter who wins money everything gone be the same
    couldn't have said it any better, it doesn't MATTER WHETHER HE WINS OR NOT things will become worse
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    I vote Obama still.
    Hes for GLBT Rights.
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    Romney before-hand used notes during the debate! He cheated!! Here is the link http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/video...BgPb2Yx7Xz0Y11 + Do not watch FAUX News, it is all corrupted and manipulated...
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    presidents and governments are all for themselves they will not benefit anybody who ever is the leader so to speak, if the other guy wins things will become worse than how it is now.
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    You brought up good points. But the presidents is just a puppet anyway
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by dominicansharingan View Post
    Romney before-hand used notes during the debate! He cheated!! Here is the link http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/video...BgPb2Yx7Xz0Y11 + Do not watch FAUX News, it is all corrupted and manipulated...
    thanks for telling me and enlightening it to the public i had no idea
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cursed Prince View Post
    You brought up good points. But the presidents is just a puppet anyway
    This also, in fact all presidents are/were puppets
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    ....anyway,obama got this....
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    obama FTW...
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    Well, I don't live in USA, but I live a little at south (Mexico) And it's quite the same. IFE (Electoral Federal Institute) is the organization in charge of the debates, and they must ask for permission of the parties to make the debates...Because it's forbidden for IFE to do a >>debate<< where the candidate of any party it's not present, according to our electoral laws...cause it would give the present candidates more advertising :sy: As dumb as it sounds.
    Now, recently there was this twitter movement called yosoy132@ (or something like that) that somehow managed to do a independent debate cause it was not a official one...so it wouldn't be put on national tv...(as a matter of fact no tv channel covered it)..but guess what? Some radio stations did covered it and since the questions were directly from the twitter movement the young folks heard it and it seems like it made some difference at the final numbers.
    But he! Polls are also manipulated here. Since the begging of the campaign, EPN candidate was always shown with adventage, which might not be true according to certain incidents...
    Why I'm telling ya this? Because the morals of the tale are:
    1.Don't trust polls to choose your vote.
    2. If ya really want to know what a candidate will do once it becomes president, check its background. Before ya can get nominated by a party ya must have some career behing ya. Check what your candidates have done (with Obama should't be difficult).
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    I'm not an America citizen, but I would vote for Obama. Obama has more of my respect then Mitt(ens). Over here in Oz when politicians are having a debate or whatnot, they are pretty much a bunch of children fighting over the last piece of candy. It's chaos.
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    Obama was unprepared and very out of his league that night. That's the truth.

    People poke at Romney's bombastic nature, yet they forget that Obama was the exact same 4 years ago.

    Obama gets so many excuses, it's not even funny.

    Still, Obama will probably win and still take hardworking people's tax dollars and give them to people who don't work.
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain America View Post
    Obama was unprepared and very out of his league that night. That's the truth.

    People poke at Romney's bombastic nature, yet they forget that Obama was the exact same 4 years ago.

    Obama gets so many excuses, it's not even funny.

    Still, Obama will probably win and still take hardworking people's tax dollars and give them to people who don't work.
    seriously man i totaly feel that... people on the base probaly dont care or dont know the difference between obama and romney the difference in policies and beliefs... example, like you said obama wants to tax the middle class up the ass.... in office he changed a major requirment to get welfare... also try doing some research on him he was a lawyer has never ran a business... hell he has shit morals you know he voted to pass a law stating thaqt if an abortion fails and the baby makes it out during a partail birth abortion( this is when the baby comes out partialy and u stick a needle in the brain to kill it) then the baby shoudnt get any food medical attention till it dies.. morals like that? dam
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    The moderator was a weak pushover and he deserved to get plowed over the way he did. And Romney didn't use notes during the debate; that's complete bull shit, as anyone should be able to see. The problem that was brought up, the only one in this thread that has any pertinence, was the third party candidates being locked out. Money runs the system. To establish integrity, gotta cut the money ties. Super PAC's, party run debate organizations, they gotta go. No second guess on that; the campaign system has to be redone.
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    ...Romney used notes? Wow...I've never seen someone with such a cold stare ever perform in such a way while looking at notes. Obama hung his head through the whole thing like the coward he is. Let's at least vote for someone with the rocks to do what needs to be done.
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monster nagato View Post
    i hate this i dont matter who wins money everything gone be the same
    I made this thread because I know what it feels like to have that sense of hopelessness.

    That's why I would suggest voting for ether Dr. Jill Stein or Rocky Anderson — neither of them are dirty in the ways mention in the OP.


    Quote Originally Posted by zesto View Post
    couldn't have said it any better, it doesn't MATTER WHETHER HE WINS OR NOT things will become worse
    I submit to you that voting for ether Dr. Jill Stein or Rocky Anderson would actually make things better. The whole reason for Obama not keeping his campaign promises is because of pressure from his corporate sponsors.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arsenicpop View Post
    I vote Obama still.
    Hes for GLBT Rights.
    So are Dr. Jill Stein or Rocky Anderson, for the Green Party and the Justice Party. Why not vote for them?

    Quote Originally Posted by dominicansharingan View Post
    Romney before-hand used notes during the debate! He cheated!! Here is the link http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/video...BgPb2Yx7Xz0Y11 + Do not watch FAUX News, it is all corrupted and manipulated...
    Please make your own thread — I don't need interference like this. Yes that's right — your running interference and derailing the topic.

    Romney and Obama CONSPIRED as to what the debates would be, so why would it even matter that Romney cheated or not?


    Quote Originally Posted by Cursed Prince View Post
    You brought up good points. But the presidents is just a puppet anyway
    The ones hired by corporations, yes.

    Why don't you read up on the other three and get back to us.


    Quote Originally Posted by COLONELJJ81 View Post
    ....anyway,obama got this....
    That may be, but that's not the point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Supermacaquecool View Post
    Well, I don't live in USA, but I live a little at south (Mexico) And it's quite the same. IFE (Electoral Federal Institute) is the organization in charge of the debates, and they must ask for permission of the parties to make the debates...Because it's forbidden for IFE to do a >>debate<< where the candidate of any party it's not present, according to our electoral laws...cause it would give the present candidates more advertising :sy: As dumb as it sounds.
    Now, recently there was this twitter movement called yosoy132@ (or something like that) that somehow managed to do a independent debate cause it was not a official one...so it wouldn't be put on national tv...(as a matter of fact no tv channel covered it)..but guess what? Some radio stations did covered it and since the questions were directly from the twitter movement the young folks heard it and it seems like it made some difference at the final numbers.
    But he! Polls are also manipulated here. Since the begging of the campaign, EPN candidate was always shown with adventage, which might not be true according to certain incidents...
    Why I'm telling ya this? Because the morals of the tale are:
    1.Don't trust polls to choose your vote.
    2. If ya really want to know what a candidate will do once it becomes president, check its background. Before ya can get nominated by a party ya must have some career behing ya. Check what your candidates have done (with Obama should't be difficult).
    Both excellent points!

    To be honest, it doesn't surprise me that Mexico is ahead of the US on issues like these. You have free Collages which is the sign of a country that has invested in the future of humanity.


    Quote Originally Posted by Nathan. View Post
    I'm not an America citizen, but I would vote for Obama. Obama has more of my respect then Mitt(ens). Over here in Oz when politicians are having a debate or whatnot, they are pretty much a bunch of children fighting over the last piece of candy. It's chaos.
    You should look in to whether there are similar barriers in place for candidates of specific Parties.

    Quote Originally Posted by Germanicus View Post
    The moderator was a weak pushover and he deserved to get plowed over the way he did. And Romney didn't use notes during the debate; that's complete bull shit, as anyone should be able to see. The problem that was brought up, the only one in this thread that has any pertinence, was the third party candidates being locked out. Money runs the system. To establish integrity, gotta cut the money ties. Super PAC's, party run debate organizations, they gotta go. No second guess on that; the campaign system has to be redone.
    Germanicus, that was by design! The moderator was SUPPOSED to be a push over!

    The thing with Romney isn't that he actually brought some thing to the debate, it's that he wasn't called out on it. We all know how Romney has flaunted his white privilege but to do so and not get called out on about it by the Moderator, the Media [fox] or Obama is strait up rubbish.

    As per your last point, I agree. Money has run things for FAR to long. It' time things actually change.

    †††

    TO EVEY ONE ELSE ON THE THREAD SO FAR THAT I DID NOT RESPOND TO —

    Next time, read my threads before answering to them.

    FOR ANY ONE WHO'S INTERESTED —

    If you want to watch two of the third party candidates debate with Obama and Romney then you can do so here at Democracy Now!
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by 'Toxic View Post
    This sounds about right, I will like to comment but I have to go out. Will come back and say something afterwards.

    Btw thank you for mentioning me
    I can't wait!!!
     
         

  20. #20
    Senior Member Supermacaquecool's Avatar
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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by ImmaculateShadow View Post
    I made this thread because I know what it feels like to have that sense of hopelessness.

    That's why I would suggest voting for ether Dr. Jill Stein or Rocky Anderson — neither of them are dirty in the ways mention in the OP.



    I submit to you that voting for ether Dr. Jill Stein or Rocky Anderson would actually make things better. The whole reason for Obama not keeping his campaign promises is because of pressure from his corporate sponsors.


    So are Dr. Jill Stein or Rocky Anderson, for the Green Party and the Justice Party. Why not vote for them?


    Please make your own thread — I don't need interference like this. Yes that's right — your running interference and derailing the topic.

    Romney and Obama CONSPIRED as to what the debates would be, so why would it even matter that Romney cheated or not?



    The ones hired by corporations, yes.

    Why don't you read up on the other three and get back to us.



    That may be, but that's not the point.


    Both excellent points!

    To be honest, it doesn't surprise me that Mexico is ahead of the US on issues like these. You have free Collages which is the sign of a country that has invested in the future of humanity.



    You should look in to whether there are similar barriers in place for candidates of specific Parties.


    Germanicus, that was by design! The moderator was SUPPOSED to be a push over!

    The thing with Romney isn't that he actually brought some thing to the debate, it's that he wasn't called out on it. We all know how Romney has flaunted his white privilege but to do so and not get called out on about it by the Moderator, the Media [fox] or Obama is strait up rubbish.

    As per your last point, I agree. Money has run things for FAR to long. It' time things actually change.

    †††

    TO EVEY ONE ELSE ON THE THREAD SO FAR THAT I DID NOT RESPOND TO —

    Next time, read my threads before answering to them.

    FOR ANY ONE WHO'S INTERESTED —

    If you want to watch two of the third party candidates debate with Obama and Romney then you can do so here at Democracy Now!

    Well, not quite like that. We have a high illiteracy rate, but I guess it helps out that our two best universities are free.
    Anyway, I agree with germanicus' point bout money running everything, but we have to remember democracy is supposed to be the representation of a whole country. We should vote for the candidate we feel has the better policies for the major part of population, and also that allows to have some kind of interaction with his/her administration. If ya can't question your government, then either your country is slowly moving to fascism and oligarchy ore ya are already in that kind of system.
    Going back to the OT, usually independent candidates are willing (at least more than the ones of the bigger parties) to consider what population says. Young folks does not realize that what we do now -related to politics- will decide the kind of government future generations will have. Tho I highly doubt a independent candidate will win this, to show your support to them has a great impact in the image of parties. Also, the important thing right now is to achieve variety on congress, so ya have some kind of representation in the higher politics spheres.
    History changes occurs slowly, don't give up (hum! I should take my own word)
     
         

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    Re: The truth behind the Presidential “Debate” Oct. 4th 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Supermacaquecool View Post
    Well, not quite like that. We have a high illiteracy rate, but I guess it helps out that our two best universities are free.
    Anyway, I agree with germanicus' point bout money running everything, but we have to remember democracy is supposed to be the representation of a whole country. We should vote for the candidate we feel has the better policies for the major part of population, and also that allows to have some kind of interaction with his/her administration. If ya can't question your government, then either your country is slowly moving to fascism and oligarchy ore ya are already in that kind of system.
    Going back to the OT, usually independent candidates are willing (at least more than the ones of the bigger parties) to consider what population says. Young folks does not realize that what we do now -related to politics- will decide the kind of government future generations will have. Tho I highly doubt a independent candidate will win this, to show your support to them has a great impact in the image of parties. Also, the important thing right now is to achieve variety on congress, so ya have some kind of representation in the higher politics spheres.
    History changes occurs slowly, don't give up (hum! I should take my own word)
    The US has a lot of people, well at least that I've met, who will tell you that the US is not in fact a Democracy but a Republic — where we elect officials to do most of the work for us. Unfortunately, this is true and always has been here in America.

    I say unfortunately but truth be told it's not completely worthless as a system of government. For instance — if the people of the US were more mobilized, in the sense of cohesive goal orientated groups, taking to the streets and stopping traffic for what we wanted then our leaders would be afraid of the public. Which is right where representatives should be. Afraid they'll piss off the masses.

    That's what the Occupy movement was all about — and still is — it's just not going to gain the kind of momentum it needs to become a revolution until there is a tipping point. Which no one knows what will be.

    As you said history takes small steps to change the course of.


    Quote Originally Posted by 'Toxic View Post
    You know, I watched the debate at 8pm and around 9pm or 9:05 I stopped listening to it and changed the channel. Normally I will sit there and hear them debate to hear their inputs and plans but somehow, like you said..it did seemed staged. I felt like Obama wanted to say more than what he said, Mitt seemed overly confident as if he already knew he would 'take the win' in the debate.
    [._.] *nods knowingly*

    But it's an interesting point you bring up because a few days ago I was reading and I have to agree that:

    Political parties only Divide the nation.

    George Washington for example, hated the very idea of parties. He distrusted what he called "factions" He despised anything that "put in the place of the delegated will of the nation the will of a party" He denounced all combinations and associations designed to direct, control, counteract, or awe the regular deliberation and action of the government. He believed political parties to be destructive because they were only focus on the soul purpose of reaching their own interests, not truly those of the people.
    Yes, but ... GW was also some one who believed, along with the other founding fathers, that power needed to stay in the capable hands of the few intelligent & wealthy men in the country that could be trusted to cater to the wealthy land owners so as to protect their interests. Think about it — if you have a democracy, people could potentially make business fair and property available for all.

    And like I said where we want the representatives scared to make the wrong move NOT confident that they are the only people who can make the right move.


    If we're honest with ourselves, we have seen both sides, the republicans and democrats- control, manipulate and lie to their voters by giving them promises that later on they don't fulfill.

    I've never been one to care so much about politics, I lost my faith in the government but like my teacher said "If you don't vote, don't b*tch." The only reason, I would ever vote is to keep the narrow minded people who want to keep America in the 15th century from achieving that goal. So far the Democrats are more liberal than the Republicans and since those two parties are always the ones going head to head against each other. It'll be pointless to support another party that will only have 5% of the votes, though this year it seems to me that everyone wants to vote for neither.

    Now, I shall go die in bed from this cold I have :silly:
    One book I think I could suggest is Death of the Liberal Class by Chris Hedges. It's about the true place of the liberal class in our society and how it has disappeared from it.

    As far as the two party notion goes — I had some one, an avid Rush Limbaugh listener, at work last Thursday tell me that there is only meant to be two parties because that's the way it's been since the beginning ... that's how fracked up this country is.

    Blinded by the American dream, every one convinced that 'their' intellectual ghetto is where the rest of the county should live, controlled by consumption.

    — cheers
     
         

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