Re: Itachi > Kakashi, Obito (no rinnengan), etc....
Well I haven't said where, but my point is that if it goes on in a Madaras cave (as an example) it would clearly give obito and advantage given he passes around underground. If it was deep below ground it could also give itachi the advantage, since if he could monitor all walls around him for 5 mins, obito would really lose. Now this is using "real" logic. I mean if obito is forced to go tangible somewhere with no room, he should theoretically be smashed to death from the pressure from his surroundings. It also wouldn't make sense if he was able to do that. However, in Naruto logic it might not be the case.
Originally Posted by Agent 47
Another example could be on the middle of an ocean (sounds lame yes, but who knows its a story). Itachi has water release as well, so it would benefit him. Ameterasu isn't weakened by being on water. He probably can't hold his breath for 5 minutes, so obito could still pass deep under water, but he could see him coming from anywhere. Also maybe susano can keep the water out, and he can stay under water with air enough for 5 mins. Could be possible? Can't tell. But just an example. Same if he fought gara in a desert right? Could he really escape under the sand then?
That was my point at least.
This is true, but again do you think Itachi needs to maintain his susano to avoid any attack from obito (from what we have seen)? I mean he can activate susano pretty fast. Of course if we start taking things as life force, illness, blindness into play it is a different story..
Obito goes underground, Itachi dosent know from where he will come out again. Itachi cannot maintain his susano for very long. Obito follows the strategy of tiring Itachi out. Itachi cant spam MS techniques very well.
Yeah well, my goal with this thread also was to offend some people.. Anyway the "goal" wasn't to prove that itachi beats obito in a fight. My general opinion of "versus" threads is that none can be determined by just shinobi skills. I just wanted to prove that itachi in a young age was above obito, fact... but when they are matched obito is still 10 years older than itachi, so that also gives advantage. As you see from my thread my evidence is to say how talented and feared itachi was.
I am willing to end this debate at a tie if you will because you dont seem to be a troll or a fanboy, otherwise i usually debate far more aggressively. On that note, i have not mentioned anything outside the manga either.
Yes yes, but even shinobi have pride. If Obito and Itachi were to duel eachother, I highly doubt Obito would just "run" if he was about to lose. I mean why didn't Jiraya just get summoned to the toad land (which i cant spell and wont google ). And can find many other examples. Perhaps I get flamed if I say that in obitos case pride might not count, but actually he seems determined to do anything to make his plan come true, even give up his pride.
We all have opinions, it dosent simply makes us a fanboy, Okay since you are so bent on it i will reread your OP and make a post on it as well. Idk about Kakashi but Obito is more or less on par with Itachi...I could turn the fact around by saying Itachi uses haxxed Susano techniques. Its his battle style using Space time whether we like it or not.
Yeah and as I wanted to say with it, was simply that Itachi is better than obito in most cases, just like sasori is better than granny chiyo in most cases, but that is not what determines a battle. As we agreed to end it in a tie
Another simple fact is that a battle between the 2 will depend on far more factors that the above mentioned by you.
Yeah he did, but gotta say that I'm surprised he didn't realize that Kakashi would send the rasengan to his dimension, caue he must have noticed the kunai scratching him, so he should have anticipated that Kakashi would know, or at least have a theory he would want to test again. So I can't really say he is such a genius as kakashi, and kakashi himself put itachi at that genius state as well.
We havent seen a lot of Obito action but the way in which he has manipulated so many S rank ninja's i would say he is far smarter than we know.And he will show it in battle too. He used some good tactics against Kakashi,Gai and Naruto
I've always been against that ABC theory thing. It's impossible to do that everybody knows both due to what chakra type they are, what unique abilities they have, and what kind of counter jutsus a person posses. Those who don't take that into account shouldn't even post threads, so don't know why you mention it.
ABC theories dont work with Naruto. Saying A>B and B>C so A>C wont work.
dont go about following words of characters. There are too many plot holes there. Feats are the only reliable indicator. An example would be where Itach said Jiraiya could solo both him and Kisame. Its an obvious plot hole but its a character statement. The quality of your debate depends on your information and most of what you present is character dialogues which hardly mean much specially in case of Obito who has been lying since the time he was shown.
Regarding what a character says in the manga I don't think you can relate that when it comes to itachi. first of all itachi didn't want to kill jiraya even if he could, and he knew that kisame knew who jiraya is, so saying they should run didn't seem suspicious at all.
Now you brought that example up I may suspect it is because I mentioned him as one of my favorite characters
and frankly to be honest, the only plot hole I see in it, is that Kishi hadn't decided how strong he would actually make Kisame at the time, cause then Kisame wouldn't have just played along with itachi all along.. He was the new member though, but honestly Itachi is about 18 at this time, Kisame mid 20's.. Jiraya a sage in his 50's. Tbh he could have fought them for long in sage mode, and eventually backup could have arrived.
We also don't know how strong itachi actually was at this moment, since we didn't see his susano till 3 years later when he fought Sasuke.