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  1. #21
    Senior Member TurrinB's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Cuz Yahiko flat out rejected Obito.
     
         

  2. #22
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurrinB View Post
    Cuz Yahiko flat out rejected Obito.
    Konan couldn't connect the dots and figure out that Obito approached them and thus might have had something to do with it?
     
         

  3. #23
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Akatsuki wasn't former at the time. They were wearing cloaks but not the Akatsuki cloaks and you would figure they would be very similar since they were the ones that started it. On the first page Obito is telling them about an organization to help bring out the full potential of the rinnegan not necessarily the Akatsuki organization but the key part of this is that he tells Nagato as they were walking off that he would be there everyday at the same time. Which means he could have convinced Yahiko to start up the Akatsuki through Nagato by telling him about to power of the rinnegan which no one else know anything about and telling him that if they were to create an organization to capture the tailed beast they could create the world that Yahiko mentioned he wanted. Nagato was clearly the one he was after in the first place but he know the only way to get to him to go along with the plan was to get Yahiko on board somehow.
     
         

  4. #24
    XX. The Judgement Tartarus's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    you people do realize that the akatsuki already existed before Obito approached the ame orphans. She was surprised becuase it sounded crazy that he may have caused Yahiko to create akatsuki.
     
         

  5. #25
    逆説 Gyakusetsu's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by shyarkugan View Post
    you people do realize that the akatsuki already existed before Obito approached the ame orphans. She was surprised becuase it sounded crazy that he may have caused Yahiko to create akatsuki.
    Yep that's the point. When Tobito revealed to Konan, it was after he had defeated her. No reason to lie to a dying person you just killed. Her shock makes complete sense and the reveal does nothing to answer the question, unless......................
     
         

  6. #26
    Kimblee Vs. Kisame Floydical's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    This topic was made last week.

    Its really, realllllly simple. Tobi simply did to Yahiko what we just saw him do to Nagato. While Yahiko was still alive and before he formed the organization, Tobi often dropped by and whispered in his ear about things, most likely forming that organization. The 3 of them were not likely together 24/7, so Tobi could easily have manipulated Yahiko without the other 2 knowing or perhaps simply with them nearby.

    And obviously, Tobi was also able to later convince Nagato to join his side after yahiko kicked the bucket and Nagato became full-on emo.
     
         

  7. #27
    XX. The Judgement Tartarus's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gyakusetsu View Post
    Yep that's the point. When Tobito revealed to Konan, it was after he had defeated her. No reason to lie to a dying person you just killed. Her shock makes complete sense and the reveal does nothing to answer the question, unless......................
    that page was before their fight even started
     
         

  8. #28
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by DeadManWonderLand View Post
    Once again not a plot hole.He did not make them form akatskui.Akatskui was already formed but the version had different ideals all obito is doing here is to push there group in a new direction.The akatskui they know today which was completely different then the one yahiko describes in that very same chapter.I seriously cannot comprehend the number of people on this base who do not know the definition of plot hole lmao
    ^^ This
     
         

  9. #29
    Kimblee Vs. Kisame Floydical's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    As to the timeline, can anyone actually prove that this all occurred after they formed the first Akatsuki? The way I see it, this was before the first group was formed and therefore closes all plotholes. Keep in mind, I read all the posts and I'm not convinced that these old cloaks mean they already formed the group. Do you see any of their allies around that we got used to in chapter 607? No. Does wearing these cloaks confirm that the organization was already formed? NO!

    Here they are wearing the cloaks BEFORE forming the group:



    Granted, they form the group a page later but days, weeks or even months could have passed between these panels, we've all seen that before. Now this would mean that by the end of the flashback in 511, they had already met Tobi and Zetsu, but who's to say they didn't? They could have simply not mentioned the event because Yahiko told them to ignore it (despite Tobi manipulating Yahiko already). I see no significant plot hole here and I see no reason to believe that Tobi did not convince Yahiko to form the first Akatsuki.
     
         
    Last edited by Floydical; 10-25-2012 at 12:04 AM.

  10. #30
    XX. The Judgement Tartarus's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by Floydical View Post
    As to the timeline, can anyone actually prove that this all occurred after they formed the first Akatsuki? The way I see it, this was before the first group was formed and therefore closes all plotholes. Keep in mind, I read all the posts and I'm not convinced that these old cloaks mean they already formed the group. Do you see any of their allies around that we got used to in chapter 607? No. Does wearing these cloaks confirm that the organization was already formed? NO!

    Here they are wearing the cloaks BEFORE forming the group:



    Granted, they form the group a page later but days, weeks or even months could have passed between these panels, we've all seen that before. Now this would mean that by the end of the flashback in 511, they had already met Tobi and Zetsu, but who's to say they didn't? They could have simply not mentioned the event because Yahiko told them to ignore it (despite Tobi manipulating Yahiko already). I see no significant plot hole here.
    oh ok, your way makes sense too. I never saw things as a plot hole but you're right there isn't any solid proof of them already forming the akatsuki.
     
         

  11. #31
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    Re: Another plothole?

    how can some of u retards not know wat a plot hole is
     
         

  12. #32
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gyakusetsu View Post
    Yes but discounting the cloaks completely the headbands that Yahiko, Konan and Nagato are wearing say to me that they have already formed Akatsuki.

    The headbands mean they are Amegakure not Akatsuki.
     
         

  13. #33
    逆説 Gyakusetsu's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by Floydical View Post
    This topic was made last week.

    Its really, realllllly simple. Tobi simply did to Yahiko what we just saw him do to Nagato. While Yahiko was still alive and before he formed the organization, Tobi often dropped by and whispered in his ear about things, most likely forming that organization. The 3 of them were not likely together 24/7, so Tobi could easily have manipulated Yahiko without the other 2 knowing or perhaps simply with them nearby.

    And obviously, Tobi was also able to later convince Nagato to join his side after yahiko kicked the bucket and Nagato became full-on emo.
    Have to ask how likely is that, and why the subterfuge at this point of the story? These are Tobito's own flashbacks. It isn't likely that we are going to see something that demonstrates that he slowly converted Yahiko. Instead we are shown that Yahiko flatly rejected Tobito and told him to stay away. How likely is it that this will be re-visited and what is the point of dragging it out? How does that advance the storyline? Now Nagato seems intrigued I agree, but that isn't what he told Konan and once again why the subterfuge?

    Quote Originally Posted by shyarkugan View Post
    that page was before their fight even started
    You're right, I misremembered, however since it appears that your supporting the idea that he was not lieing to Konan by your other posts it really doesn't matter and the point is still valid that the reveal does nothing to answer the question of how it was possible that Tobito influenced Yahiko to form the Akatsuki.

    Quote Originally Posted by Floydical View Post
    As to the timeline, can anyone actually prove that this all occurred after they formed the first Akatsuki? The way I see it, this was before the first group was formed and therefore closes all plotholes. Keep in mind, I read all the posts and I'm not convinced that these old cloaks mean they already formed the group. Do you see any of their allies around that we got used to in chapter 607? No. Does wearing these cloaks confirm that the organization was already formed? NO!

    Here they are wearing the cloaks BEFORE forming the group:

    Granted, they form the group a page later but days, weeks or even months could have passed between these panels, we've all seen that before. Now this would mean that by the end of the flashback in 511, they had already met Tobi and Zetsu, but who's to say they didn't? They could have simply not mentioned the event because Yahiko told them to ignore it (despite Tobi manipulating Yahiko already). I see no significant plot hole here and I see no reason to believe that Tobi did not convince Yahiko to form the first Akatsuki.
    Yes, but discounting the cloaks completely the headbands that Nagato, Konan and Yahiko are wearing say to me that they have already formed Akatsuki.



    Quote Originally Posted by Odemgee View Post
    The headbands mean they are Amegakure not Akatsuki.
    Did they wear them before they formed the group? It is a statement that they are not going to submit to Hanzou and are taking back their country. That is why Hanzou considered them such a threat, they weren't his ninjas.
     
         
    Last edited by Gyakusetsu; 10-25-2012 at 06:44 AM.

  14. #34
    Member Odemgee's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gyakusetsu View Post
    Did they wear them before they formed the group? It is a statement that they are not going to submit to Hanzou and are taking back their country. That is why Hanzou considered them such a threat, they weren't his ninjas.
    If you look at Hanzo's symbol on his helmet is the same symbol as there headbands and then look at pains headband during the time they were with Akatsuki it's the same symbol with a slash through it which is what all the Akatsuki members did to there headband showing the former association of the village they were with.
     
         

  15. #35
    逆説 Gyakusetsu's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by Odemgee View Post
    If you look at Hanzo's symbol on his helmet is the same symbol as there headbands and then look at pains headband during the time they were with Akatsuki it's the same symbol with a slash through it which is what all the Akatsuki members did to there headband showing the former association of the village they were with.
    You do realize that Yahiko formed the Akatsuki and they're original methods were quite different than what it later became? The first headband slashed came from Nagato and it was just after Yahiko's death.
     
         
    Last edited by Gyakusetsu; 10-25-2012 at 06:57 AM.

  16. #36
    Member Odemgee's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gyakusetsu View Post
    You do realize that Yahiko formed the Akatsuki and they're original methods were quite different than what it later became? The first headband slashed came from Nagato and it was just after Yahiko's death.
    I'm just saying that the symbol on there headband is the Amegakure symbol not the Akatsuki symbol. When Yahiko was alive when the Akatsuki was formed all of the members were Amegakure that's why they all had the headbands with that symbol on it not because they were Akatsuki.
     
         

  17. #37
    逆説 Gyakusetsu's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by Odemgee View Post
    I'm just saying that the symbol on there headband is the Amegakure symbol not the Akatsuki symbol. When Yahiko was alive when the Akatsuki was formed all of the members were Amegakure that's why they all had the headbands with that symbol on it not because they were Akatsuki.
    It's also a statement, a means of unifying Yahiko's group, and at no previous point do we see the Ame orphans wearing it until the original Akatsuki is formed.
     
         

  18. #38
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gyakusetsu View Post
    It's also a statement, a means of unifying Yahiko's group, and at no previous point do we see the Ame orphans wearing it until the original Akatsuki is formed.
    Akatsuki was formed to bring peace to Amegakure the symbol on there headbands is to show there pride in there village which the four vertical lines is the symbol of their village which is the same reason Hanzo has the same symbol on his helmet because he was the leader of the village at the time. Hanzo felt that the Akatsuki which were all Amegakure were becoming to powerful and were a risk of over throwing his rule so he planned to destroy the Akatsuki which led to Yahiko's death. Yahiko didnt hate the village he just didnt like the direction it was going so they possible starting wearing them to show their pride in the village which was the symbol showing you were a ninja of Amegakure which was the symbol worn before the Akatsuki was even formed.
     
         

  19. #39
    Senior Member NarutoKage2's Avatar
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Quote Originally Posted by Odemgee View Post
    Akatsuki was formed to bring peace to Amegakure the symbol on there headbands is to show there pride in there village which the four vertical lines is the symbol of their village which is the same reason Hanzo has the same symbol on his helmet because he was the leader of the village at the time. Hanzo felt that the Akatsuki which were all Amegakure were becoming to powerful and were a risk of over throwing his rule so he planned to destroy the Akatsuki which led to Yahiko's death. Yahiko didnt hate the village he just didnt like the direction it was going so they possible starting wearing them to show their pride in the village which was the symbol showing you were a ninja of Amegakure which was the symbol worn before the Akatsuki was even formed.
    The movement started by yahiko which had hidden rain ninja in it was akatsuki. At the most, you can say that obito later manipulated and changed it, however the latest chapter does nothing to suggest obito had anything to do with the original organization like he told konan. However madara might have kept tabs on nagato so maybe he was the one who somehow spurred yahiko.
     
         

  20. #40
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    Re: Another plothole?

    Oh yay! Another "Another plot hole" thread

    The original incarnation was already established when Tobi approached them.
     
         
    Last edited by Draxus; 10-25-2012 at 08:28 AM.

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