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  1. #76
    Eternal Dawn Lightbringer's Avatar
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by Necromancer4276 View Post
    I don't understand why people try to counter knowledge that a character admits himself... Why argue that Hashirama can't defeat Madara when Madara himself said he could. Why argue that Itachi couldn't defeat Tobi when Tobi himself says he could have...? Unless more information comes out which contradicts the comment by the character such as why Itachi lied saying jiraiya could beat him, then just take the quote at face value.
    When Obito dodged amaterasu, he said if Itachi knew his secrets then he would have died. So that basically interprets to if Itachi knew about(lets say kamui, cause that's my guess on what it was) Itachi would be able to kill him with amaterasu? I really doubt it....if it was Izanagi....itachi would have already known about that technique and sure as hell would assume "Madara" would have it.

    so even if Itachi knew about kamui(not all of it, but just the part where he can be transparent) Do you really believe he could still kill him? Obito has both sharingan and hashi cells which give him both better stamina than Itachi and reflexes are on par, if not better. His genjutsu could plausibly be superior due to him being able to fully control a jinchuriki and manipulate a country through him.

    Itachi could only go as far as stun someone with genjutsu, not kill(like tobi did with konan), nor control anyone with it. His susanoo can probably be warped through and the Totsuka blade is a hit or miss.

    And also he's been trained by madara himself, making him almost equal to EMS/MS Madara.....so that is my reason for believing that Itachi could not kill Obito.

    I'm not saying Itachi has no chance whatsoever, but it is unlikely.
     
         

  2. #77
    Member frbro82's Avatar
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Nono nono more like minato could have killed obito if he wanted too
     
         

  3. #78
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    You don't see it do you? Itachi was in the way for the plan with Sasuke, nothing more.
     
         

  4. #79
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightbringer View Post
    Considering that Obito knows about izanami, he would surely be careful of it after implementing Izanagi.....and that's even if he uses it at all.
    How exactly do you avoid it ?
     
         

  5. #80
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightbringer View Post
    When Obito dodged amaterasu, he said if Itachi knew his secrets then he would have died. So that basically interprets to if Itachi knew about(lets say kamui, cause that's my guess on what it was) Itachi would be able to kill him with amaterasu? I really doubt it....if it was Izanagi....itachi would have already known about that technique and sure as hell would assume "Madara" would have it.

    so even if Itachi knew about kamui(not all of it, but just the part where he can be transparent) Do you really believe he could still kill him? Obito has both sharingan and hashi cells which give him both better stamina than Itachi and reflexes are on par, if not better. His genjutsu could plausibly be superior due to him being able to fully control a jinchuriki and manipulate a country through him.

    Itachi could only go as far as stun someone with genjutsu, not kill(like tobi did with konan), nor control anyone with it. His susanoo can probably be warped through and the Totsuka blade is a hit or miss.

    And also he's been trained by madara himself, making him almost equal to EMS/MS Madara.....so that is my reason for believing that Itachi could not kill Obito.

    I'm not saying Itachi has no chance whatsoever, but it is unlikely.
    Itachi can clearly kill and or control people with his sharringan, he was surprised kakashi didn't die from his genjutsu and shikaku Nara said that "only itachi can control this many people" during the war. And obito is not equal or almost equal to and madara, that is another foolish statement. Obito was not loyal to itachi, he was cautious of him
     
         

  6. #81
    Member frbro82's Avatar
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by frbro82 View Post
    Nono nono more like minato could have killed obito if he wanted too
    When obito attacked the leaf. Minato had a chance to kill Obito
     
         

  7. #82
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by Lilt View Post
    Pretty obvious, I'd say, but hey, here's the argument:

    1. Obito said Itachi could kill him with knowledge



    And knowledge is gained from experience, for those of you who don't know.

    So Obito carefully guarding his secrets means he was the one keeping his distance.

    2. Why didn't Itachi kill him then?



    Why didn't the Five Kages and all of their guards kill Tobi?

    Why'd didn't Minato with all of Konoha kill Tobi?

    Because Obito can phase out of and teleport away from any fight.

    3. Itachi was the one (who couldn't teleport) surrounded by Tobi's allies.



    Why didn't Tobi defeat Itachi and control him with genjutsu like he did with Yagura?

    Why didn't Tobi store Itachi in the handy-dandy pocket-dimension until he needed him like with Torrune?

    Why didn't Tobi replace Itachi with a White Zetsu clone for Sasuke like he did with Kisame?

    Why did Tobi hide in the shadows for years when Itachi joined, and didn't emerge until just before Itachi died?

    4. Itachi was Tobi's problem.



    Regardless of translation specifics, Itachi was a problem.

    And Tobi didn't make a move on Konoha until Itachi was dead.

    If Tobi betrayed a pact after the pactmaker died, that means he didn't respect the pact.

    Only the pactmaker. Tobi didn't move purely because he didn't want to cross a living Itachi.

    He had Akatsuki annihilating Konoha before Itachi's body was even cold.

    4. Tobi thought Itachi was the bee's-knees. Itachi thought Tobi ['current Madara'] was pathetic.





    And you'd be surprised how many can't differentiate 'pathetic shell of former self' from 'invincible Madara.'

    5. Tobi's Kamui has an obvious counter.



    Tobi cannot attack and defend at the same time.

    Gai countered Obito's offense with his nunchucks. It isn't unstoppable.

    But guess who has clones? Guess who can fool a Dragon Sage and EMS user with feints?

    Guess whose clones explode, which can make Obito absorb explosive damage like Konan did?

    Heck, he has exploding clones and one of the fastest ninjutsu and one the fastest jutsu molding speeds.

    Itachi's a walking counter to Obito's Kamui.

    The author wouldn't even have to create new jutsu out of nowehere for Itachi to look great...

    5. Tobi's only other primary jutsu was Izanagi



    Who was that ninja with the jutsu specifically designed to trounce Izanagi?

    Conclusion

    So, why didn't the terminally ill teenager with deteriorating eyesight that was waltzing around the enemy base as a known double-agent for nearly a decade, who was actively keeping the Big Bad from attacking Konoha again, kill the Big Bad? Because the Big Bad was hiding in the shadows. He was hiding from Itachi so effectively that even the readers didn't know he existed until the 300 chapters in.
    im not an itachi fanboy but i agree with this ^^
     
         

  8. #83
    Member Enton's Avatar
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    obito never said itachi could kill him. he said the sneaked amaterasu wouldve killed him if itachi had knwoledge on his powers. itachi fans always making things up.
     
         

  9. #84
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by Enton View Post
    obito never said itachi could kill him. he said the sneaked amaterasu wouldve killed him if itachi had knwoledge on his powers. itachi fans always making things up.
    yah... that is what the poster of this tread is trying to say... he could kill obito...
     
         

  10. #85
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    of course itachi would win
    he had a secret weapon that would make kamui useless
    in fact he never showed his "full arsenal", he has dozens of legendary weapons for owning every ninja in this show
     
         
    Last edited by lol99; 11-15-2012 at 08:46 AM.

  11. #86
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    agree
     
         

  12. #87
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by USSJ Future Trunks View Post
    obito had his opinion. it doesnt mean itachi could have actually acted on it and used the intel wisely. he stil has no counter for kamui.

    guess whos EVEN faster? has EVEN more dangerous summons that can destroy clones by roaring? guess who fooled 4 kage level shinobis and would have slaughtered them if it werent for kakashi having his other eye? and yes he can attack and defend at the same time. he can turn objects intangible right? so he should be able to turn the fan intangible, put it through itachis neck then go tangible again. you act as if kamui is his sole attack. if obito got close enough he can wrap itachi up in chains and warp him. we also know he can warp just about anything smaller than he is. so bye bye clones. you cant do shit if your being warped faster than even kakashi could react to. and kakashis kamui actually outpaced obito's vision. so who really has the fastest ninjutsu?

    he hid in the shadows because he wanted to fool all of akatsuki except pain and konan and work without anyone bothering him. if it werent for jiraiya and the sand village, akatsuki would still be in the shadows working as a a mere mercenary organisation being hired out by the nations. gaaras capture was really the first thing to be saying "yes we are here, and we are stealing jins". deidara said they captured the other jins without trouble because the villagers almost cheered them on. yagura doesnt have an MS.
    i assume tobi didnt want to kill itachi as itachi was still an akatsuki working for them and wasnt leaking any valuable information. why rob himself of a valuable asset?

    he was living up to the pact which is obviously void now that the person who suggested it is dead. obito exploited a loophole. if he didnt give a shit about it he has several powerful s-class ninjas who can kill itachi for him. unless your suggesting itachi > all of akatsuki.

    and yet doesnt. izanami is weird but it cant counter izanagi. not the way that itachi explained it. if it forces people to accept the outcome, its still useless if your dead before you activate it. how many chapters did sasuke say "is it ready yet? is it ready yet?" izanamis prep time is horrible and itachi even says its not meant to be used unless theres two izanagi users arguing about what reality they should change. basically to stop people spamming it. but they STILL needed it to win important battles.

    he had a golden opportunity when he was still healthy and fresh from killing his clan. he didnt because he stood no chance yet and if he didnt then, he never would

    yeah and yet they praise obito and kakashi even more. jiraiya said minato >>>itachi

    mr know it all here. i could counter atleast 3 of these but i can't be stuffed. but on the good side, i agree with a lot you have said. nice catch.
     
         

  13. #88
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    This topic never ends well. There is no solid proof either way.
    Those in favour or against this idea have no proof. There are many reasons for both doing what they decided to do and not confronting each other. This can be translated in many ways by those in favour or against this.

    Nobody will reach the truth until its explicitly stated in the manga
     
         

  14. #89
    ブロリー伝説の超 Uchiha Hinrik's Avatar
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightbringer View Post
    Wow that's just pulling logic out of your ass now. So you disregard his illness when he was alive? That just proves his limit as a character. If we take out the flaws of every character, then everyone would be on a much higher level also. And no, he got backlash because he has poor stamina reserves and also don't forget that he drains chakra by using the MS and also gets blind from it. And I'm pretty sure Kishi would not kill him off for good without showing all of his jutsu, which is why he revived him in the first place.

    Obito has better and more efficient control of his sharingan, without the backlashes. And Itachi winning fights in no time was only because each of those fights he used genjutsu, and that wouldn't work on Obito I'd wager. And him being so smart to win every situation is just fanboism. He is intelligent, but you forget that so is Obito, possibly more so seeing as though that he was able to fool all 5 countries and subordinates into his plan and is also a master at persuading people to his cause.
    What? the reason he has low chakra is because he is sick, and even though he was sick he still outlasted sasuke in their fight.
     
         

  15. #90
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    *THUMP* .. *THUMP THUMP* *THUMP* You guys hear that? LOOK>>>> A STAMPEDE of Obiti/Tobi Fanboys are coming.. RUN!!.. RUN For your lives!!!!!!!!!! Aaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh
     
         

  16. #91
    Uchiha member. ixc's Avatar
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightbringer View Post
    Wow that's just obvious fanboism now. How is Itachi better with the sharingan, give me actual examples? Obito so far only utilize 2 techs with his MS: his kamui, which makes him practically invincible and can also be a one hit kill if he teleports you to the dimenstion(except for Kakashi). He also used Izanagi to escape a 10min explosion. Itachi can't do Izanagi because he doesn't have senju DNA.
    Also Obito's Sharingan Genjutsu was powerful enough to control a jinchuriki host to his will. Not only is it impossible for other users to catch them in genjutsu, but Obito managed to make a whole nation under his control by manipulating Yagura. I'd say that alone makes him a lot better with the sharingan.

    Also Obito was trained by Madara himself, teaching him the proper use of the sharingan and improving his skill the highest quality so that the plan doesn't fail. And there is absolutely no argument when it comes to Madara>Itachi. Which means Obito is almost at his level.

    And guess what, Obito can outlast Itachi also due to Hashi cells. He had possibly the longest battle in the naruto manga, and he still hasn't gone all out. His chakra reserves must be huge if he was able to first do the six paths, then control the Bijuu, then fighting on his own with only taijutsu and Kamui. And he was fighting 4 really powerful characters at the same time. Naruto, Bee, Guy, and Kakashi.

    They are far more powerful than they were when Itachi fought them and more powerful now than any other opponent on their own Itachi faced back then, except for Kabuto.

    Ok, and Itachi said Kabuto was even better at lying than he was? and Kabuto wasn't able to persuade sasuke, when Obito did....your point? If Itachi was so good at persuading people, he would have been able to quell the Uchiha uprising or even convince Danzo.

    And yeah, I'm sure we've seen all his cards now. And if he does have something left, it wouldn't be anything big like Izanami anymore. Saying that he has more moves is wishful thinking of a fanboy, it's not a fact. All of the akatsuki members showed all that they were capable of when they were alive, which is why they never had much spotlight as edos, because we've seen everything. Itachi was an exception, but now we have, and now he's gone for good.

    Obito wins, and the only chance Itachi has is his Totsuka blade. But seeing as though that Obito can dodge 4 people at the same time and become transparent, that's hardly going to work on him.
    I'm not going to read the rest because you obviously come up with bullshit. Itachi has IZANAMI which was made to COUNTER IZANAGI. THIS ALONE gives Itachi an edge over Obito.
     
         
    Last edited by ixc; 11-15-2012 at 10:08 AM.

  17. #92
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by USSJ Future Trunks View Post
    and yet doesnt. izanami is weird but it cant counter izanagi. not the way that itachi explained it. if it forces people to accept the outcome, its still useless if your dead before you activate it. how many chapters did sasuke say "is it ready yet? is it ready yet?" izanamis prep time is horrible and itachi even says its not meant to be used unless theres two izanagi users arguing about what reality they should change. basically to stop people spamming it. but they STILL needed it to win important battles.
    I'm not sure if you've seen the chapters very well but Izanami was pretty much prepaired in the very beginning, all Itachi had to do was start a loop and it was just Sasuke being impatient. Still Izanami is a way to counter Izanagi so Obito can use his Izanagi all day Itachi will counter it.
     
         

  18. #93
    Scavenger of humans sorrow phantomlord22's Avatar
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    no he couldn't I believe
     
         

  19. #94
    みかん〜4代目翻訳 英語 The ProphecY's Avatar
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by ixc View Post
    I'm not sure if you've seen the chapters very well but Izanami was pretty much prepaired in the very beginning, all Itachi had to do was start a loop and it was just Sasuke being impatient. Still Izanami is a way to counter Izanagi so Obito can use his Izanagi all day Itachi will counter it.
    Izanami might not work against Tobi since he accepted himself as "no one" & he must have a knowledge of it as compared to Kabuto.

    Anyways on topic, Tobi wasn't or will never be afraid to fight Itachi or any other member of Akatsuki. This has been shown as he was so confident to take on Kabuto even with the presence of the 5 strongest members of Akatsuki in front of him. This of course includes Edo-Itachi, Edo-Nagato, blah.. blah.. & so forth.. The fact that Tobi decided not to pursue on invading Konoha when Itachi was stil alive, doesn't necessarily mean or prove anything that he was intimidated by Itachi's power. There were reasons why he intends not to attack the village because:
    1.) It was part of their arrangements, or as long as Itachi performs his tasks as an Akatsuki, their agreements were still honored.
    2.) He wanted Itachi to die at Sasuke’s hand so he could manipulate Sasuke on his own way.
    3.) Itachi joined Akatsuki in order to keep an eye on the organization. Thus, it could deteriorate most of Tobi's plan because Itachi could provide ample intel's to the rest of the villages about the Akatsuki's doings, goals & purposes, strategy, member's strengths & weaknesses or their jutsu's & capabilities.

    Furthermore, Tobi seemed to be one-step ahead against Itachi. He knew the truth about him, the reasons why he wanted to die at Sasuke's hand, his real purpose of joining Akatsuki, & fooled him by letting him believed he was Uchiha Madara. Also, Itachi's plan for Sasuke failed only because of Tobi's intervention.

    Thus, it was never stated in the manga that Tobi wished to kill or fight Itachi. However, one of Itachi's main goals is to kill Tobi. He even planted amaterasu in to Sasuke's eyes hoping it will eventually kill him.

    So my conclusion, pre-rinnegan Tobi > ms Itachi. Itachi even believed that Tobi (a.k.a. Uchiha Madara during that time) was invincible & immortal. If he could actually kill him, since he loved the village & Tobi was the biggest threat, he must have accomplished that a long time ago.
     
         

  20. #95
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Sakura can beat Itachi IFFFF he loses his arms and legs and goes completely blind and is zapped of all chakra. See what I did there? "IF" don't mean a thing in the real world or in naruto. "IF" Itachi knew Obito's secrets, he would've killed him. But the reality? He didn't. So he would've been owned. Obito>Itachi. Get over it No "IFs" about it.
     
         

  21. #96
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Quote Originally Posted by troyg39 View Post
    Sakura can beat Itachi IFFFF he loses his arms and legs and goes completely blind and is zapped of all chakra. See what I did there? "IF" don't mean a thing in the real world or in naruto. "IF" Itachi knew Obito's secrets, he would've killed him. But the reality? He didn't. So he would've been owned. Obito>Itachi. Get over it No "IFs" about it.
    LOL what kind of bullshit comment is this? There's not even prove that Itachi can't counter Kamui lol. Itachi owns Obito get over it. See what i did there?
     
         

  22. #97
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    yup, obito is dumb, itachi would get him
     
         

  23. #98
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    lol, your arguments are poor at best. Tobi upheld his pact with Itachi until the end. he didn't kill Itachi because a. itachi's plan for sasuke suited him perfectly b. itachi was doing his job working for akatsuki while doing nothing to sabotage their plans.

    if itachi could have killed tobi he would have, he was smart enough to realise what tobi would do after he died. but he laid a trap for tobi instead of attacking head on. and that says it all really
     
         

  24. #99
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Of course Itachi could devise a plan only if he knew everything about Tobi. Here are the reasons why Itachi couldnt beat him.

    1. Itachi thought he was Madara Uchiha.
    Yes guys Obito fooled everyone. He told Sasuke that Madara is a unstoppable Immortal. He was afraid he didnt know all he powers and was cautious around a man said to fight on par with the First Hokage. He didnt dare provoke Obito until he knew all his secrets .

    2.He didnt know the secrets of his Kamui. If Itachi knew what Konan knew,im pretty sure he would find a way to kill him,even with Izanagi (Itachi knew about Izanagi too but im pretty sure its only because Obito taught him it) Itachi said Obito was also his teacher so im pretty sure Obito taught him Izanami,Izanagi ad the rest of the Sharingan techs.

    3.Itachi didnt know Obito collected Sharingan. If he did,he would know that Obito would use his Izanagi to get rid of the Amaterasu without any risk since he could replace the eye he lost.

    3.Obito knew everything about Itachi. Obito is the one who taught Itachi since he was 13 years old. If someone has full knowledge of your abilities and you dont know theirs,you are ****ed.

    Is knowledge of your opponent really that important? Yes. Nagato said if Jiraiya knew the secrets of Pain then he would have been defeated. Naruto knew all of Pain's secrets and still couldn't beat him until he gave in to the Kyubi and Minato helped him afterwards. If Naruto didnt know anything about Pain,he would have been beaten easily. If Jiraiya had the knowledge Naruto had,he would have beaten Pain.
     
         

  25. #100
    Uchiha member. ixc's Avatar
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    Re: Itachi could have killed Obito...

    Hahaha Obito doesn't stand a chance against Itachi now that i've seen him fighting like that in the past few chapters.

    Itachi is way smarter than Obito. Even Konan almost defeated him if the lad didn't have Izanagi and Itachi has Izanami which can counter Izanagi.

    Obito is pathetic lol.
     
         

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