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  1. #1
    Supreme Sifu of the Fists Strata Uchiha's Avatar
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    What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    If you don't know, then let me brief you on the subject.

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    A character who, although acting for primarily "evil" or selfish goals, is either not in full control of their actions or emotions and the reader or viewer can sympathize for due to them not being evil by choice, but rather by them being a victim of circumstance.

    These villains can face a crisis of conscience in which they submit to doing evil, as well as having tragic pasts, which sometimes cause them to do their evil deeds. These villains often have confused morals believing that they are doing moral when in fact they are doing evil.

    Even the protagonists can feel sympathy for tragic villains Often the hero will try to reason with the villain and implore him/her to stop their acts of evil. If the villain does do, he/she is usually redeemed. If not and is arrested or killed, the hero sometimes mourns him/her.


    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Here are the following characters that fit the bill in the Narutoverse:

    Obito Uchiha (his significant other was killed by his best friend)
    Sasuke Uchiha (his entire clan was slaughtered and he holds the Hidden Leaf's top brass responsible)
    Nagato (sucky childhood where his native land the Hidden Rain Village was always the battleground for wars)
    Orochimaru (technically...he didn't give a reason as to why he does messed up stuff, but both his parents did die.)

    The only dynamic villains who I can think of who aren't tragic villains are Danzo, Hanzo, and Madara. However, they aren't the main antagonists of the series.

    Naruto Shippuden lacks a villain who is just pure evil and rotten to the very core like Frieza or Kid Majin Buu from DBZ. There past wasn't tragic at all, and you didn't feel remorseful for him when it came time for there demise.

    Thoughts? Discuss.
     
         

  2. #2
    Senior Member NarutoSageUzumaki's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Villains become they way they are due to some childhood trauma

    it is a trademark for villains that has been that has been that way for a long time



    Hitler - driven by childhood trauma , ( his father was Jewish and he left him , thus he started hating jews )
     
         

  3. #3
    Hyōton KGB Kakuzu's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    It is entirely possible Madara csn be true evil. He has never revealed his reasons for the Moon eye plan. It is possible that the reason could be purely based on his own ambitions
     
         

  4. #4
    Senior Member ~Puppet Master~'s Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Hidan...
     
         

  5. #5
    Trolling level over 9000 markdabomb22's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    I agree most shonen villains are pamper ass. Out of the big three Bleach Villians are my favorite for there ruthlessness
     
         

  6. #6
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    I do not agree bcs that is what makes Naruto manga/anime an exemption from the others, that's why it is unique, but I do understand what you wanted to say.
     
         

  7. #7
    Supreme Sifu of the Fists Strata Uchiha's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Quote Originally Posted by markdabomb22 View Post
    I agree most shonen villains are pamper ass. Out of the big three Bleach Villians are my favorite for there ruthlessness
    Like Sousuke Aizen!!!!!

    ^ He didn't have a rhyme or reason of becoming evil except that he wanted to occupy the throne that was above everyone else.
    No traumatic past that made you feel sorry for him.
     
         

  8. #8
    Senior Member theRPGdude's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Orochimaru was the main bad guy.
     
         

  9. #9
    Member narutonish's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    The problem with villains in naruto shippuden is, they lack the intellect to explain their acts properly which makes them annoying. I can understand the reasons for Nagato, he lost his parents right in front of his eyes. Sasuke rejected the countless plea of Naruto, but after he killed Itachi and found out the real truth, he should have just killed danzo and call it even but no he wants to kill entire village now ? lol so that makes him another idiot. But Obito & madara ? Their reasons are dumb and pure bullshit.

    Personally I cant wait for 10 tails to brutally rape Madara and show him whos the boss :P As far as Obito goes, he is useless just riding on Senju DNA, I expect naruto and Kakashi to own him.
     
         
    Last edited by narutonish; 11-14-2012 at 02:58 PM.

  10. #10
    2nd Hokage Deadai's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    I like it this way, it makes the series more interesting besides black n white villians are boreing.
     
         

  11. #11
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    I heard that most readers/viewers in Japan don't favor antagonists who are evil just for the sake of being evil. The villains without tragic pasts (Aizen from Bleach for example) are better received by Western audiences apparently. You shouldn't take my word on that though as I've only heard it from one person.
     
         

  12. #12
    Supreme Sifu of the Fists Strata Uchiha's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadai View Post
    I like it this way, it makes the series more interesting besides black n white villians are boreing.
    It's possible for villains to be very intriguing even if they are bad guys "without" that whole "feel sorry for me...I'm a tragic villain."

    For example.


    ^ Akuma is evil, however, he follows a "moral code" and has "honor" which makes him a complex character to figure out.
    He stopped a death battle with one of his main rivals by the name of Gen because his very ill coughing up blood. (tuberculosis)
     
         

  13. #13
    Member Zaiigoukyou's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strata Spartan View Post
    If you don't know, then let me brief you on the subject.

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    A character who, although acting for primarily "evil" or selfish goals, is either not in full control of their actions or emotions and the reader or viewer can sympathize for due to them not being evil by choice, but rather by them being a victim of circumstance.

    These villains can face a crisis of conscience in which they submit to doing evil, as well as having tragic pasts, which sometimes cause them to do their evil deeds. These villains often have confused morals believing that they are doing moral when in fact they are doing evil.

    Even the protagonists can feel sympathy for tragic villains Often the hero will try to reason with the villain and implore him/her to stop their acts of evil. If the villain does do, he/she is usually redeemed. If not and is arrested or killed, the hero sometimes mourns him/her.


    --------------------------------------------------------------

    Here are the following characters that fit the bill in the Narutoverse:

    Obito Uchiha (his significant other was killed by his best friend)
    Sasuke Uchiha (his entire clan was slaughtered and he holds the Hidden Leaf's top brass responsible)
    Nagato (sucky childhood where his native land the Hidden Rain Village was always the battleground for wars)
    Orochimaru (technically...he didn't give a reason as to why he does messed up stuff, but both his parents did die.)

    The only dynamic villains who I can think of who aren't tragic villains are Danzo, Hanzo, and Madara. However, they aren't the main antagonists of the series.

    Naruto Shippuden lacks a villain who is just pure evil and rotten to the very core like Frieza or Kid Majin Buu from DBZ. There past wasn't tragic at all, and you didn't feel remorseful for him when it came time for there demise.

    Thoughts? Discuss.

    I kind of like it.

    It's more realistic.

    Very rare are people just pure evil.

    There is usually some sort of traumatic experience or experiences in their lives which leads them down the path of evil.

    Most people who commit massacres by shootings suffered some sort of trauma in their lives.

    Like another poster said hitler's hatred stemmed from his childhood.

    People who are "born" evil and have the evil gene still have the chance to be good but if they are traumatized or not filled with love their natural instincts will consume them.

    This was the case with Gaara.

    It gets very old seeing the typical "NOW I SHALL TAKE OVER THE WORLD/NOW I WILL DESTROY EVERYTHING" villian in every game, comic, movie etc. etc.

    Sasuke is my favorite villian beause the pain he suffers is the pain most of us deal with on a daily basis.

    The urge for revenge.
     
         

  14. #14
    Member Zaiigoukyou's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strata Spartan View Post
    Like Sousuke Aizen!!!!!

    ^ He didn't have a rhyme or reason of becoming evil except that he wanted to occupy the throne that was above everyone else.
    No traumatic past that made you feel sorry for him.
    IMO aizen wasn't evil.

    He was ruthless, and insane but not evil.

    The hollow shieker now that is an evil character.

    The guy killed some boys mother and killed the boy when he was alive. When he died he trapped the boy's soul in a parrot and toyed with his soul in the afterlife and ate anyone's soul who came near the boy. He blamed every victim's soul he consumed on the boy to torture him

    That was the most emotional moment in Bleach ever.
     
         
    Last edited by Zaiigoukyou; 11-14-2012 at 03:10 PM.

  15. #15
    Kaika Saisei 開花再生 Chatte's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    They are not seriously villains because this whole manga is centered around one subject: emotions.
    All did this because of their emotions. Oro had his parents killed, Obito had Rin killed, Sasuke we know the case, Nagato.. the same.
     
         

  16. #16
    Supreme Sifu of the Fists Strata Uchiha's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaiigoukyou View Post
    I kind of like it.

    It's more realistic.

    Very rare are people just pure evil.

    There is usually some sort of traumatic experience or experiences in their lives which leads them down the path of evil.

    Most people who commit massacres by shootings suffered some sort of trauma in their lives.

    Like another poster said hitler's hatred stemmed from his childhood.

    People who are "born" evil and have the evil gene still have the chance to be good but if they are traumatized or not filled with love their natural instincts will consume them.

    This was the case with Gaara.

    It gets very old seeing the typical "NOW I SHALL TAKE OVER THE WORLD/NOW I WILL DESTROY EVERYTHING" villian in every game, comic, movie etc. etc.

    Sasuke is my favorite villian beause the pain he suffers is the pain most of us deal with on a daily basis.

    The urge for revenge.
    I do like Sasuke because he's all over the place.

    First he was a tragic hero. Then an anti hero. Then a cold blooded tragic villain. And now more recently, a villainous philosopher that perhaps his sins may be redeemed. He kind of reminds me of Vegeta in a bunch of ways.
     
         

  17. #17
    Senior Member Sasunarufan13's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    I'd say Orochimaru is pretty evil >_>
    Madara seems to be just power hungry and that gives him the evil bad guy status, but well, we don't know a lot about his motives.
    But Hidan seemed evil/insane to the core if you ask me. Thrived on killing other people. Kakuzu fits that bill as well though for him it had more financial reasons. But the again, they weren't the main villains ...
     
         

  18. #18
    Member l Sasuke Uchiha l's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    We can't be to sure about Madara, cus we don't know his reason behind the "Eye Moon Plan". For all we know he could be doing it for Izuna, which basically makes him the same as Obito.
     
         

  19. #19
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    yes there are no villains who are just evil and they know it. evil villains think there are good (madara, obito, nagato) and thats why the will be victim of talk no jutsu.

    first i thought tobi is just pure evil but after that rin history....
    and i doubt madara is pure evil.
     
         

  20. #20
    Supreme Sifu of the Fists Strata Uchiha's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sasunarufan13 View Post
    I'd say Orochimaru is pretty evil >_>
    Madara seems to be just power hungry and that gives him the evil bad guy status, but well, we don't know a lot about his motives.
    But Hidan seemed evil/insane to the core if you ask me. Thrived on killing other people. Kakuzu fits that bill as well though for him it had more financial reasons. But the again, they weren't the main villains ...
    I was going around the lines of main villains, but yeah you do bring up some valid points.

    Kakuzu is so bo$$! "Even Hell runs on money. I'd be just fine" He just had to be trolled in this war.....
     
         

  21. #21
    Senior Member AlexXx's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Quote Originally Posted by l Sasuke Uchiha l View Post
    We can't be to sure about Madara, cus we don't know his reason behind the "Eye Moon Plan". For all we know he could be doing it for Izuna, which basically makes him the same as Obito.
    that will be probably the case.
     
         

  22. #22
    Apple pie of doom apple pie of doom's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Obito and Madara's goal, infinite tsukiyomi, is'nt evil evil.
    You're trapped in a good dream forever, that does'nt sound too bad to me.

    Evil does'nt exist in the narutoverse.
    Danzou, for example, is one of the noblest persons in the Narutoverse.
     
         

  23. #23
    Member SixPathsOfTobi's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strata Spartan View Post
    Orochimaru (technically...he didn't give a reason as to why he does messed up stuff, but both his parents did die.)
    I have the most sympathy for orochimaru's way of life and it has nothing to do with his parents..
    He's looking for how things work, for how the world works, for what makes things tick.. etc. He's completely understandable, the other villains that do stuff because they lost someone, you can somewhat get sympathy for them, but how far they go because of that..


    The only dynamic villains who I can think of who aren't tragic villains are Danzo, Hanzo, and Madara. However, they aren't the main antagonists of the series.
    Danzou has been indoctrinated with how a shinobi should be, that he should die at the battlefield etc. his parents died at the battlefield etc. he's like the creator of the CIA only than with real interest in the welbeing of his homeland.


    Naruto Shippuden lacks a villain who is just pure evil and rotten to the very core like Frieza or Kid Majin Buu from DBZ. There past wasn't tragic at all, and you didn't feel remorseful for him when it came time for there demise.
    No this is why naruto is great, because you don't have such bullshit people that want to destroy the entire universe and be immortal so that they can be alone forever in the darkness of space and don't even have a little moment in history that leads them to becoming that.
     
         

  24. #24
    Supreme Sifu of the Fists Strata Uchiha's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Quote Originally Posted by apple pie of doom View Post
    Obito and Madara's goal, infinite tsukiyomi, is'nt evil evil.
    You're trapped in a good dream forever, that does'nt sound too bad to me.
    ^ The Eye of the Moon Plan is evil because it requires sacrifices of the Jinchuriki especially since it requires that Naruto, The Second Coming of the SO6P, be killed.

    That and it's a fake world.....a facade controlled by Madara and Obito.
     
         

  25. #25
    Member l Sasuke Uchiha l's Avatar
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    Re: What's up with all of these "tragic villains" in Naruto?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strata Spartan View Post
    ^ The Eye of the Moon Plan is evil because it requires sacrifices of the Jinchuriki especially since it requires that Naruto, The Second Coming of the SO6P, be killed.

    That and it's a fake world.....a facade controlled by Madara and Obito.
    The Eye of the Moon plan doesn't require Naruto nor Killer Bee to be killed... -_- It might not have needed any of hte Jinchuriki's to be killled in the first place. Also the world would be controlled by Madara alone, Madara has no real feelings or need for Obito anymore.
     
         

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