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  1. #151
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by Owarij View Post

    Right, it was stated by both Dan and Madara that only Hashirama can defeat Madara... we know this,

    but as exaar said, Muu also stated that only Onooki can defeat him,
    You claim he was speaking of the people on the battlefield ?

    No.. If he was, he would have said, you're the only person here who can defeat me... he did not say that... he said exactly what madara etc said... You're the only person who can defeat me...

    By YOUR logic, and this entire threads logic, automatically Muu > Madara , Muu > Hashirama... Don't be stupid.. these statements aren't to be taken as fact..... Muu could not possibly know all the ninjas who existed at that time...
    If muu knew of nagato etc, he would never have said such a thing.... Naruto was the one to defeat muu, rendering his statement fallacious ..... The fact that madara and dan, like muu know nothing of any other ninjas of the current time renders their entire statement void




    Let's put the icing on the cake

    The only info Dan would ever have on Madara is what? up to EMS ...If there are any information on him in books, then it would only go up to him having ems, since he went into hiding afterwards...
    EMS Madara Would have been defeated by the combination of Onooki, Gaara and Naruto
    If Madara did not have rinnegan, it would have been over..

    This means that DAN'S statement is instantly void... since he stated that only Hashirama can defeat EMS madara


    Now lets look at the Viz scan of what madara actually said
    "Only hashirama could ever stop me "

    This can be interpreted in two ways, the one I believe due to the obvious evidence stated above, is he was speaking in PAST tense , And saying Hashirama was the only person who could ever stop him in the past, and he's not here at the moment....
    That would be a logical thing that madara would say.. since he clearly doesn't know the strengths of the ninja who exists in this time.. It would make NO sense for him to be talking in the present tense
    I see you put a lot of effort into that, but most of this information is currently irrelevant. This is not Edo-Madara vs Hashirama. If anything, it is Hashirama vs Hiruzen, and we all know how that ends.
    I do, however agree with your statement that character statements should not be taken so seriously. Read my other posts in this thread.
     
         

  2. #152
    Savior Of The World MickNerks's Avatar
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by LegendaryAce View Post
    Yet you know nothing about this prime hiruzen .. As you don't know anything about hashiramas prime .. Arguably he died before he reached his full potential ... Did minato die in his prime ? ..judging from what we have seen hashirama >>> hiruzen

    And Kakashi fodder ? what I think we are done here
    If you believe hiruzen is god on par with so6p can't change your mind
    How much chakra did hiruzen have?
    How many jutsu could he actually use in battle?
    Kakashi knows 1k one should have let him best itachi in gen but he got rapped badly
    Kakashi knows 1k jutsu he got raped by pain
    Some of those he probably wasn't even able to use ..

    He probably knew 1k but could only use so many
    Exactly my point.. We havent seen anyone in there prime so you should judge them. the only way we can deduce who is stronger is thru what the manga says.. The manga says hiruzen is the strongest hokage and it also says he is the strongest shinobi of all time.. It calls hashirama the strongest shinobi of his era and says that he is the only one who can beat madara. So basically the manga has said hiruzen is the strongest.

    1. I was saying kakashi is fodder compaired to hiruzen in his prime. Im not saying that kakashi is absolutely fodder.

    I didnt say hiruzen was on the same level as the so6p.smh
     
         

  3. #153
    Member Superior's Avatar
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by MickNerks View Post
    Exactly my point.. We havent seen anyone in there prime so you should judge them. the only way we can deduce who is stronger is thru what the manga says.. The manga says hiruzen is the strongest hokage and it also says he is the strongest shinobi of all time.. It calls hashirama the strongest shinobi of his era and says that he is the only one who can beat madara. So basically the manga has said hiruzen is the strongest.

    1. I was saying kakashi is fodder compaired to hiruzen in his prime. Im not saying that kakashi is absolutely fodder.

    I didnt say hiruzen was on the same level as the so6p.smh
    Correction on the bolded text. The only way we can deduce who is stronger is through what the manga shows, not what it says. I have said this about 4 times now throughout this thread. From what we have seen, Hiruzen Sarutobi is not on the same level as Hashirama Senju. I don't care what the characters say, as character statements almost always contradict each other.
    Until I see this "Prime" Hiruzen, I am not convinced.
     
         

  4. #154
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by Owarij View Post

    Right, it was stated by both Dan and Madara that only Hashirama can defeat Madara... we know this,

    but as exaar said, Muu also stated that only Onooki can defeat him,
    You claim he was speaking of the people on the battlefield ?

    No.. If he was, he would have said, you're the only person here who can defeat me... he did not say that... he said exactly what madara etc said... You're the only person who can defeat me...

    By YOUR logic, and this entire threads logic, automatically Muu > Madara , Muu > Hashirama... Don't be stupid.. these statements aren't to be taken as fact..... Muu could not possibly know all the ninjas who existed at that time...
    If muu knew of nagato etc, he would never have said such a thing.... Naruto was the one to defeat muu, rendering his statement fallacious ..... The fact that madara and dan, like muu know nothing of any other ninjas of the current time renders their entire statement void




    Let's put the icing on the cake

    The only info Dan would ever have on Madara is what? up to EMS ...If there are any information on him in books, then it would only go up to him having ems, since he went into hiding afterwards...
    EMS Madara Would have been defeated by the combination of Onooki, Gaara and Naruto
    If Madara did not have rinnegan, it would have been over..

    This means that DAN'S statement is instantly void... since he stated that only Hashirama can defeat EMS madara


    Now lets look at the Viz scan of what madara actually said
    "Only hashirama could ever stop me "

    This can be interpreted in two ways, the one I believe due to the obvious evidence stated above, is he was speaking in PAST tense , And saying Hashirama was the only person who could ever stop him in the past, and he's not here at the moment....
    That would be a logical thing that madara would say.. since he clearly doesn't know the strengths of the ninja who exists in this time.. It would make NO sense for him to be talking in the present tense
    What do you say about the scan where the anbu call hashirama and Tobirama the strongest ?

    And hiruzens statements could also be taken differently

    Like this one
    He was said to be the strongest hokage

    1. Who said he was
    2. Do the people who said this have full info on other hokages
    3. Where did iruka hear this
    4. Is this the same people who don't believe in the so6p and hashiramas godlike powers

    When people see something op they immediately think that's the best the people who said that probably saw hiruzen do something hard and thy hailed him as the strongest without full info on others it's like let say 100 years of now or even now ask normal kids who was the smartest person in the world people may not even know who .. If tey say Einstein they probably don't know why he was known as the smartest ... 50 years from now people will be saying for example Steven Hawkins was the smartest based on what info they have I doubt they will have full info on Einstein ..even though some of Stevens work is based on einsteins theories - does that mean Steven has a better understanding ect probably not
    ( bad example but I don't know how else to explain what I really want to say)

    Also all hiruzen has is hype - it's not even backed up at all I could say oonoki > hiruzen from what we've seen the statements only work for the people in hiruzens time and after since they know what is only written about hashirama - ( it's easier to believe something you have seen than something you have heard about ) like the whole Jesus thing people will say show me god and how do you expect someone to show you ( sorry lets not involve religion )
     
         

  5. #155
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by MickNerks View Post
    Exactly my point.. We havent seen anyone in there prime so you should judge them. the only way we can deduce who is stronger is thru what the manga says.. The manga says hiruzen is the strongest hokage and it also says he is the strongest shinobi of all time.. It calls hashirama the strongest shinobi of his era and says that he is the only one who can beat madara. So basically the manga has said hiruzen is the strongest.

    1. I was saying kakashi is fodder compaired to hiruzen in his prime. Im not saying that kakashi is absolutely fodder.

    I didnt say hiruzen was on the same level as the so6p.smh
    WRONG. We have no FEATS of Hiruzen's prime.... Yet Hashirama has the feat of taking on the strongest out of the 9 tailed beasts and the strongest Uchiha...

    Also where is it stated Hiruzen IS the strongest Hokage??? where? or the IS the strongest Shinobi.. hell strongest and shinobi aren't even used togather for him. lmao.

    Also, your 1000 jutsus doesn't mean anything.. since Kakashi is 1000+ now. ;x.

    Lets put together the manga...

    Dan says : Only the first hokage could stop Madara

    Obito: Strongest Shinobi of his time

    Madara : People CALLED him the strongest shinobi./ Ultimate Shinobi


    Ok so Dan says Ems Madara > Hiruzen automatically. And since Ems Madara > Hiruzen... and Hashirama was in Madara's time.. and was the most feared and the strongest shinobi... in which way in hell is he not the strongest.
     
         

  6. #156
    Savior Of The World MickNerks's Avatar
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by Superior View Post
    Correction on the bolded text. The only way we can deduce who is stronger is through what the manga shows, not what it says. I have said this about 4 times now throughout this thread. From what we have seen, Hiruzen Sarutobi is not on the same level as Hashirama Senju. I don't care what the characters say, as character statements almost always contradict each other.
    Until I see this "Prime" Hiruzen, I am not convinced.
    But you havent seen what hashirama can do.. You are only going off what people have said.. Other than seening flowering tree world and wood dragon, you know nothing of hashirama's strength and what he can truely do..
     
         

  7. #157
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    It's said that hirzuens the strongest hokage but it doesn't change the fact that his fight with orochimaru was far from impressive. Tbh hashirama wasn't impressive either. The only shinobi inside that barrier that looked impressive ws Tobirama. I'm sure a bunch of people can agree with that.

    I think it's obvious that kishi made a mistake with both hashirama and hiruzen.

    It's really weird that people really consider hiruzen as the strongest when the jutsu arsenal he displayed was close to pathetic. Shadow clone shuriken. Dragon flame bomb. Mud wall. And shadow clones. He had to take a draw by using minatos technique. Him being old is NOT an excuse because what oonoki is doing now is off the charts for a old guy. Never once complained about his chakra reserves as hiruzen did the entire fight.

    Like I said before the manga stated that he was the strongest but his performance says otherwise. Being old isnt a excuse. Oonoki tsunade and chiyo are perfect examples of that.
     
         

  8. #158
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by MickNerks View Post
    Exactly my point.. We havent seen anyone in there prime so you should judge them. the only way we can deduce who is stronger is thru what the manga says.. The manga says hiruzen is the strongest hokage and it also says he is the strongest shinobi of all time.. It calls hashirama the strongest shinobi of his era and says that he is the only one who can beat madara. So basically the manga has said hiruzen is the strongest.

    1. I was saying kakashi is fodder compaired to hiruzen in his prime. Im not saying that kakashi is absolutely fodder.

    I didnt say hiruzen was on the same level as the so6p.smh
    No the scan I mean is when Orochimaru summons 1st and second ... The anbu says the strongest shinobi (both hashirama and Tobirama ) doesn't say of their time
     
         

  9. #159
    終 充琉寿 Owarij's Avatar
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Pe
    Quote Originally Posted by Superior View Post
    I see you put a lot of effort into that, but most of this information is currently irrelevant. This is not Edo-Madara vs Hashirama. If anything, it is Hashirama vs Hiruzen, and we all know how that ends.
    I do, however agree with your statement that character statements should not be taken so seriously. Read my other posts in this thread.
    what?? I'm replying to op and thesage dude who made an argument stating Hiruzen's hype is void because dan stated Hashirama is the only person that can defeat Madara
     
         

  10. #160
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    A scan to end all of the hiruzen fans.. Since your relying on Iruka's " said to be strongest hokage"... And it was said in part 1.. then we will also use a scan from part 1. A scan that says Tobirama and Hashirama > Sarutobi and plus.. its not vague as "Said to be".. but its "Hailed as ":

     
         

  11. #161
    Ruler of Omacron Persei 8 Lrrrrr's Avatar
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by KingHashirama View Post
    A scan to end all of the hiruzen fans.. Since your relying on Iruka's " said to be strongest hokage"... And it was said in part 1.. then we will also use a scan from part 1. A scan that says Tobirama and Hashirama > Sarutobi:

    And what happened after that? Hiruzen owned um
     
         

  12. #162
    Senior Member TheSages456's Avatar
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by Owarij View Post

    Right, it was stated by both Dan and Madara that only Hashirama can defeat Madara... we know this,

    but as exaar said, Muu also stated that only Onooki can defeat him,
    You claim he was speaking of the people on the battlefield ?

    No.. If he was, he would have said, you're the only person here who can defeat me... he did not say that... he said exactly what madara etc said... You're the only person who can defeat me...

    By YOUR logic, and this entire threads logic, automatically Muu > Madara , Muu > Hashirama... Don't be stupid.. these statements aren't to be taken as fact..... Muu could not possibly know all the ninjas who existed at that time...
    If muu knew of nagato etc, he would never have said such a thing.... Naruto was the one to defeat muu, rendering his statement fallacious ..... The fact that madara and dan, like muu know nothing of any other ninjas of the current time renders their entire statement void




    Let's put the icing on the cake

    The only info Dan would ever have on Madara is what? up to EMS ...If there are any information on him in books, then it would only go up to him having ems, since he went into hiding afterwards...
    EMS Madara Would have been defeated by the combination of Onooki, Gaara and Naruto
    If Madara did not have rinnegan, it would have been over..

    This means that DAN'S statement is instantly void... since he stated that only Hashirama can defeat EMS madara


    Now lets look at the Viz scan of what madara actually said
    "Only hashirama could ever stop me "

    This can be interpreted in two ways, the one I believe due to the obvious evidence stated above, is he was speaking in PAST tense , And saying Hashirama was the only person who could ever stop him in the past, and he's not here at the moment....
    That would be a logical thing that madara would say.. since he clearly doesn't know the strengths of the ninja who exists in this time.. It would make NO sense for him to be talking in the present tense
    LMFAO what kind of crap is this? kishis portrayal of how only hashirama can beat madara isnt contradicted as of yet since none of the shinobi that madara is facing can beat him so your nonsense about dans statement being voided is countered right there. "only hashirama could ever stop me" isnt contradicted since none of the new shinobi(naruto, kakashi, guy) can beat him anyways.

    naruto didnt beat mu by himself unless you crossed into some alternate dimension where naruto and his clones soloed the edo army with no other shinobi around.
     
         

  13. #163
    Elite Assassin LegendaryAce's Avatar
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by MickNerks View Post
    But you havent seen what hashirama can do.. You are only going off what people have said.. Other than seening flowering tree world and wood dragon, you know nothing of hashirama's strength and what he can truely do..
    Erm ... Madara .. Yamato .. I dare say zetsu are used to show hashiramas techniques
     
         

  14. #164
    Member Superior's Avatar
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by MickNerks View Post
    But you havent seen what hashirama can do.. You are only going off what people have said.. Other than seening flowering tree world and wood dragon, you know nothing of hashirama's strength and what he can truely do..
    This is where it gets interesting. What you say is true. We have seen only some of Hashirama's abilities through Edo-Madara, and yet these abilities alone make him stronger than Hiruzen. As you say, we have yet to see what he can fully do. The same could arguably be said for Hiruzen, except for one thing.
    What we have seen of Hiruzen is not on the same level as what we have seen of Hashirama. This can not be denied. Do you mean to tell me that if we judged a fight between the two of them solely on what we have seen, excluding all hype, that Hiruzen Sarutobi would come out on top? Not even you can be that dense right?
     
         

  15. #165
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by Lrrrrr View Post
    And what happened after that? Hiruzen owned um
    What happened after was.. they left like bosses .. right after toying with Hiruzen.
     
         

  16. #166
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Did someone say oonoki doesn't complain about passing his prime lol

    OOnoki complaining about his hip



    Oonoki back goes out again lol



    oonoki back goes out yet again



    Even tsnuade in her 50z worlds greatest medical ninja talks about passing her prime




    Hiruzen held his ground hows is 3 kages vs 1 even a fair fight and on top of that 2 were immortal with undieing bodies and unlimited chakra and orochimaru had token the body of a youth. In the anal but hurt all over
     
         

  17. #167
    Ruler of Omacron Persei 8 Lrrrrr's Avatar
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by KingHashirama View Post
    What happened after was.. they left like bosses .. right after toying with Hiruzen.
    I think this signals my victory to our little debate. It was fun, but facts rule over fanboyism
     
         

  18. #168
    Member Superior's Avatar
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by Whalelord View Post
    Did someone say oonoki doesn't complain about passing his prime lol

    OOnoki complaining about his hip



    Oonoki back goes out again lol



    oonoki back goes out yet again



    Even tsnuade in her 50z worlds greatest medical ninja talks about passing her prime




    Hiruzen held his ground hows is 3 kages vs 1 even a fair fight and on top of that 2 were immortal with undieing bodies and unlimited chakra and orochimaru had token the body of a youth. In the anal but hurt all over


    None of the scans you showed effectively proved the point you were trying to make. What you were trying to say is that Oonoki, like Hiruzen complains about his old age and "passing his prime". In all of those scans, it is shown that Oonoki's old age troubles him at times, but I didn't see him once complain about it. In fact, Oonoki takes the pain as is and still fights through it; without complaining once.

    Yes, he is old, and it does affect him from time to time. But he doesn't use it as an excuse like Hiruzen did in his fight with Orochimaru. Correct me if what I've said is wrong.
     
         
    Last edited by Superior; 11-20-2012 at 01:22 AM.

  19. #169
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by Lrrrrr View Post
    I think this signals my victory to our little debate. It was fun, but facts rule over fanboyism
    Yes they do. ;] That even after Hiruzen's prime. Tobirama and Hashirama were hailed as the Best shinobi.
     
         

  20. #170
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by Lrrrrr View Post
    I think this signals my victory to our little debate. It was fun, but facts rule over fanboyism
    I do believe hiruzen was being owned until he had no choice but to use a move that kills him( that being a suicide move- last hope) also that isn't winning its drawing at most

    Minato vs kyubi did minato win?
     
         

  21. #171
    Savior Of The World MickNerks's Avatar
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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by KingHashirama View Post
    WRONG. We have no FEATS of Hiruzen's prime.... Yet Hashirama has the feat of taking on the strongest out of the 9 tailed beasts and the strongest Uchiha...
    Could it be possible that hiruzen doesnt have any battle feats because no1 was foolish enough to challenge him..lol But you right there is feats for hiruzen prime other than his enormous chakra levels and the databook giving him all 5's in everything.

    Also where is it stated Hiruzen IS the strongest Hokage??? where? or the IS the strongest Shinobi.. hell strongest and shinobi aren't even used togather for him. lmao.


    It says he is the stongest among the other 3 hokages on the wall behind him.



    He was hailed (acclaimed) as the God of Shinobi



    It is said that he is the strongest amongs the 5 kages. Seeing how kabuto isnt from the leaf village implies that it is said by people from diffrent countrys and villages.

    Also, your 1000 jutsus doesn't mean anything.. since Kakashi is 1000+ now. ;x.
    hiruzen knows more than 1000 jutsus, and he had an enormous chakra pool in his prime, which is what makes him diffrent from kakashi. Hiruzen has all 5's in data book in his prime. Kahashi does not.


    Lets put together the manga...

    Dan says : Only the first hokage could stop Madara

    Obito: Strongest Shinobi of his time

    Madara : People CALLED him the strongest shinobi./ Ultimate Shinobi


    Ok so Dan says Ems Madara > Hiruzen automatically. And since Ems Madara > Hiruzen... and Hashirama was in Madara's time.. and was the most feared and the strongest shinobi... in which way in hell is he not the strongest.

    Ok. we can do the same with hiruzen.

    Iruka: We is the greatest amongs all hokages

    Orochimaru: He who is hailed as God of SHinobi

    Kabuto: It is said he is the greatest among all 5 kages

    So accroding to Iruka, Hiruzen > Hashirama automatically. And since orochimaru and kabuto who know everything about the shinobi would deemed hiruzen as god of shinobi and the strongest of all kage that makes him more powerful then hashirama.
     
         

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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by LegendaryAce View Post
    Erm ... Madara .. Yamato .. I dare say zetsu are used to show hashiramas techniques
    but they dont show if he really has superior medical jutsu, they dont show his chakra levels, they dont show if he was good at taijutsu, kinjutsu, and other forms of ninjutsu other than mokuton. There is alot you still dont know because you havent seen him. All you really know is that he can use mokuton.
     
         

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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Well first of all i would like to suggest that "God of shinobi" title doesn't mean that the person to whom the title is assumed is the strongest person ... Don't you guys look at the qualities , virtues , kindness etc etc of that shinobi ??? ... If not , then i would like to know what would you call the most powerful creature with an evil mindset ..the demon or the God ??
     
         

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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by Superior View Post
    This is where it gets interesting. What you say is true. We have seen only some of Hashirama's abilities through Edo-Madara, and yet these abilities alone make him stronger than Hiruzen. As you say, we have yet to see what he can fully do. The same could arguably be said for Hiruzen, except for one thing.
    What we have seen of Hiruzen is not on the same level as what we have seen of Hashirama. This can not be denied. Do you mean to tell me that if we judged a fight between the two of them solely on what we have seen, excluding all hype, that Hiruzen Sarutobi would come out on top? Not even you can be that dense right?
    Hiruzen has shown us that he could counter or escape mokuton. So the one thing that we have seen from hashirama thru himself and madara is mokuton and hiruzen has been shown to escape it.. Soo what does that mean??????
     
         

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    Re: LOLL Kishimoto proves Sarutobi's hype wrong, LMAO

    Quote Originally Posted by MickNerks View Post
    Could it be possible that hiruzen doesnt have any battle feats because no1 was foolish enough to challenge him..lol But you right there is feats for hiruzen prime other than his enormous chakra levels and the databook giving him all 5's in everything.





    It says he is the stongest among the other 3 hokages on the wall behind him.



    He was hailed (acclaimed) as the God of Shinobi



    It is said that he is the strongest amongs the 5 kages. Seeing how kabuto isnt from the leaf village implies that it is said by people from diffrent countrys and villages.


    hiruzen knows more than 1000 jutsus, and he had an enormous chakra pool in his prime, which is what makes him diffrent from kakashi. Hiruzen has all 5's in data book in his prime. Kahashi does not.





    Ok. we can do the same with hiruzen.

    Iruka: We is the greatest amongs all hokages

    Orochimaru: He who is hailed as God of SHinobi

    Kabuto: It is said he is the greatest among all 5 kages

    So accroding to Iruka, Hiruzen > Hashirama automatically. And since orochimaru and kabuto who know everything about the shinobi would deemed hiruzen as god of shinobi and the strongest of all kage that makes him more powerful then hashirama.

    1. Its impossible for a shinobi to not have any battle feats.. like literally. Nor has he shown any techs as strong as Regeneration and Mokuton. ;]. Even if he was a old man.. I'm pretty sure he could've been as strong as Onoki was...

    2. Your picture is countered by this scan right when he goes against 2 of the people next to him on the wall ;p:



    3. I agree he was the strongest of the 5 kages. I believe Sarutobi > 3rd Raikage. Due to his hype. But feats wise 3rd Raikage > Sarutobi..... and Kabuto is from the leaf ;x

    4. I never read any thing about him having enormous chakra pool. But its already stated Uzumaki and Senju have the highest chakra.. Hashirama being the strongest senju > Sarutobi.. in chakra. And about the databook.. why use it when the other 2 don't have stats ;p lmao.

    5. You failed at trying to do the same. why?? Because what Iruka stated is what he heard.. not his opinion.. he casually said " He was said to be ".. But the anbu said " They are hailed as". see the difference??
     
         

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