Naruto as the villain

[narutoblitz]

A friend and I were discussing Naruto recently, and he proposed that Naruto and Konoha are the real villains in the series. More or less the 1st Hokage was an unelected dictator that ruled by strength and imposed his ideals on the society he lived in, creating a social model that forced the world into peace through control. Rendering the bijuu as weapons, he essentially turned the shinobi into slaves of their respective villages as a form of oppressive moralism. Where the weak are coddled and fostered like a virus, people are forced to allocate their resources to protecting people that have no right to exist.

Madara saw the inherent moral problem in this and tried to overthrow Hashirama as to establish a world where there are only winners, where everyone has freedom and the losers die off. Hashirama's and the Third Hokage's actions lead to countless conflicts and the creation of horrible villains like Orochimaru, who would have been killed early on in a Madara regime. So Madara recruited Obito, an Uchiha who had seen first hand the intrinsically unfair nature of the world. Because Obito had to get crushed to protect a weak little insect (Kakashi is and always has been far weaker than Obito, relying on cheap borrowed power, despite fanboy rage to the contrary)

So this basically leaves Naruto as the unwitting villain, protecting a corrupt and oppressive village that only brings conflict and disgrace to the world. Supreme ignorant in his moral beliefs, Naruto fails to understand himself or even the greater consequences of his actions. Clinging to childish, idiotic beliefs such as "Never give up" and conditionless friendship, Naruto embodies the naive and self-destructive idealism that comes with morality.

While I don't agree with him, I thought it was an interesting take on Naruto. We sort of take it for granted he's the "good guy", but really Obito is trying to create world peace in his own way and Naruto could have just resigned himself to death against Pain and nobody in the village would have been hurt or killed to begin with. In a large sense, it's his father's fault that the village was targeted by Akatsuki. Had he just sealed the 9 tails in himself and died, itd have all been over.

[Kuroh]

interesting but i also disagree with you're friend

[SasukeGrowUp]

**** every kid that is about to post, " No, shut the **** up, dumb ass," they were all abused as children. Keep your thoughts complex and your mind open :y

['Nāpalm]

Good theory.... but Naruto isn't bad. Obito isn't bad either... what is ironic is Naruto is equivalent to Obito

[★-Carnage-]

"No, shut the **** up, dumb ass"


lol jk
its interesting...but i dont agree

[DrProof]

The Akatsuki was the group trying to purge this "evil" ..

[Ldude]

I think the same thing. Obito is the savior of this world, and Madara will help him get there.

[Sexy Steel]

Pain has sort of touched on this subject saying that those who believe they are good (naruto for example) have not seen negative impacts villages impose on each other.

[nibilbhai]

I see. That friend of yours is a die hard Madara fan right?

[Paintry4]

Sup how can it be?? Do u think war brings peace but for a short period.Neither in our world after 1st world war peace sud come to us forever,is it? Noooo.
So peace sud be brought through love like naruto's doing.

[narutoblitz]

I see. That friend of yours is a die hard Madara fan right?

Yep. When we were drunk he told me the reason he moved out of America was because he thought we were the most corrupt nation on Earth and someone should put a bullet in Bush's head haha

[Tsujan9484]

Hmm...quite interesting...but I have to disagree tho..Yeah Madara and Obito are trying to create a perfect world but the way they are doing it is just wrong.....it's the same like controlling people's mind and heart with the infinite tsukyomoni...It is not true happiness, peace and there is no hope....

Naruto may be stupid, but he knows the outcome form the infinite tsykomoni....there is no winner neither loser....one's hard work and determination decides whether he is a winner or loser...That is what Naruto believes and his same belief is changing the world..Pein taught him about the love and hatred, his sensai taught him about the world...Probably he would decide how this world should go and how to achieve true happiness and peace...

As for first hokage and others, there are still story to be unfold...if you go by that logic then SO6P is the very source of all these hatred...cause he decided to choose one of his sons and discard another...so first let's see what was their story...

[Carlhens]

Dude do people on narutobase a favor and keep those thoughts to urself and urfriend

[itachifan7]

"No, shut the **** up, dumb ass"


lol jk
its interesting...but i dont agree

nice avatar bro

[Ldude]

Dude do people on narutobase a favor and keep those thoughts to urself and urfriend

Why? Because you personally have different ideas?

[narutoblitz]

Sup how can it be?? Do u think war brings peace but for a short period.Neither in our world after 1st world war peace sud come to us forever,is it? Noooo.
So peace sud be brought through love like naruto's doing.

There isn't one instance in human history where either mutual love or understanding has ever brought even a temporary peace. Whereas nuclear bombs, media control, genocide and other implements of violence have.

[nibilbhai]

Yep. When we were drunk he told me the reason he moved out of America was because he thought we were the most corrupt nation on Earth and someone should put a bullet in Bush's head haha

Ha ha, you must first visit India. It's the world's most corrupted nation.

[psukkar]

A friend and I were discussing Naruto recently, and he proposed that Naruto and Konoha are the real villains in the series. More or less the 1st Hokage was an unelected dictator that ruled by strength and imposed his ideals on the society he lived in, creating a social model that forced the world into peace through control. Rendering the bijuu as weapons, he essentially turned the shinobi into slaves of their respective villages as a form of oppressive moralism. Where the weak are coddled and fostered like a virus, people are forced to allocate their resources to protecting people that have no right to exist.

Madara saw the inherent moral problem in this and tried to overthrow Hashirama as to establish a world where there are only winners, where everyone has freedom and the losers die off. Hashirama's and the Third Hokage's actions lead to countless conflicts and the creation of horrible villains like Orochimaru, who would have been killed early on in a Madara regime. So Madara recruited Obito, an Uchiha who had seen first hand the intrinsically unfair nature of the world. Because Obito had to get crushed to protect a weak little insect (Kakashi is and always has been far weaker than Obito, relying on cheap borrowed power, despite fanboy rage to the contrary)

So this basically leaves Naruto as the unwitting villain, protecting a corrupt and oppressive village that only brings conflict and disgrace to the world. Supreme ignorant in his moral beliefs, Naruto fails to understand himself or even the greater consequences of his actions. Clinging to childish, idiotic beliefs such as "Never give up" and conditionless friendship, Naruto embodies the naive and self-destructive idealism that comes with morality.

While I don't agree with him, I thought it was an interesting take on Naruto. We sort of take it for granted he's the "good guy", but really Obito is trying to create world peace in his own way and Naruto could have just resigned himself to death against Pain and nobody in the village would have been hurt or killed to begin with. In a large sense, it's his father's fault that the village was targeted by Akatsuki. Had he just sealed the 9 tails in himself and died, itd have all been over.

frist of all if minato didn't seal in it in naruto and in himself the fox would just be revived naturally later on with no host with nagato there ready to try and capture him and now we would be in a bad situation with no chance from stoping madara.


Anyway, good thread, I like the comparison with obito and naruto. Maybe I was too harsh on obito when I flame him. but I still don't like his motivations.

[Xaviour]

interesting but i also disagree with you're friend

I disagree with your grammar But LELOUCH-SAMA!!!

But seriously Harashima has not been portrayed as that kind of person. He was elected as the Hokage by popular vote and that was that. It is quite unfair to Madara, but your friend has no real backing to that statement.

[ThEpRoMiSeDlAnD]

Plus rep bro. I've always had the ideal that no one in naruto is evil except oro. But I never thought to see it as the leaf is evil and I completely agree about naruto being naive and stupid rushing in with out understanding but the again naruto is my most hated character in the manga every week I pray he dies somehow even though he won't a man ca dream lol

[chopstickchakra]

Villain and hero are just illusionary titles bestowed unto a side by itself to help justify senseless behavior.