Sasuke's Intelligence = Minato

[Owarij]

Sasuke's "black" Chidori was only useable when he has Curse Mark activated because of its Chakra just like how Naruto can sue his "purple" Rasengan. Orochimaru helped Sasuke perfect Kirin. He didn't win. His team was in a room recovering, while Killer Bee was outside the village gate celebrating. Argument Invalid.

Minato>Sasuke

there is nothing in the manga showing Oro helped sasuke perfect kirin...
At most, like kakashi and yamato, he explained nature manipulation and let him do it himself..

THE THING IS, Unlike naruto, Sasuke was a genius who already understood nature manipulation since part 1... Kakashi stated that... so Orochimaru actually could do nothing at all..

[Ldude]

no.

kiri was from kakashi. If you mean Kirin, oro teached him how to do it

his black was curse mark from oro

sasuke didnt win he failed to capture it, minato was able to seal half of it in him self and in his son

no for example he thought he would win against kages. but he got raped

Kirin was a technique Sasuke created by himself.

[nickalfred31]

wait wait wait, sasuke won againts bee? are yo serious? he got his ass handed to him, if he was by himself, bee would have been able to kill him.
Minato was the hokage, he knew things most of the people in the village didnt know. He freaking fought in wars. that gives him war and battle experiences. your logic is not relevent to "intelligence"

[TheKyuubiIchigo]

No, just no...

[YellowFang]

Sorry you failed much hard... You didn't only say that Sasuke is somehow stronger than Minato but in the field of intelligence...
Pure insolence...

[Owarij]

Sasuke is too young to surpass Minato in terms of being a genius etc... Though he's well on his way... the boy is only 16..Give him 2 more years

[+PDatta+]

Minato Created a Rasengan, Sasuke created a Kirin

Darui has water based black lightning (imitation), Sasuke had the real deal, black chidori.

Minato and Sasuke successfully fought the two strongest tailed beast, and won.

Agree?

Minato Created a Rasengan, Sasuke created a Kirin ---->

OK... but kirin is not actually a jutsu it is just a well planned combination of series of jutsu and good control over situation

Darui has water based black lightning (imitation), Sasuke had the real deal, black chidori ---->

are you kidding me... it was just a way to show his dark side while using the cursed mark (even if you take that as a jutsu, it was just a gift from orochimaru... so sasuke didn't shake up a single nerve in his brain to develop that, on the other hand the dark lightning which darui has is a gift from 3rd raikage which 'actually' uses a huge mastery over lightning technique)

Minato and Sasuke successfully fought the two strongest tailed beast, and won ---->

minato fought kyuubi at a time when he was at a really tight situation. Still he one handedly manages to tactically deal with tobi within seconds and seal kyuubi in the next moment without loosing his cool... on other hand, sasuke was fully aware of his opponent with a full fledged team, still he was 'killed' two times, i would say suigetsu was better as a leader there(letting his teammates flea while engaging the hachibi himself and he did show some powers there)...... so, you dare not compare that punk (who doesn't care about anyone other than himself) with someone who sacrificed himself for the sake of his village.:mad:

so, for me its a BIG NO !!!

[nickalfred31]

Sasuke is too young to surpass Minato in terms of being a genius etc... Though he's well on his way... the boy is only 16..Give him 2 more years

was he a hokage? has he fought wars? is sasuke married? how many jutsus does sasuke know? 2 years? you are shitting me. he will surpass minato's knowledge but in 2 years? you are naive sir.

[Owarij]

was he a hokage? has he fought wars? is sasuke married? how many jutsus does sasuke know? 2 years? you are shitting me. he will surpass minato's knowledge but in 2 years? you are naive sir.

you think being hokage is a true testament to your strength in the village? An Uchiha Will NEVER BE Hokage..... Not when the daiymo and elders have certain criteria to follow to make the next hokage candidate...

Orochimaru already commented that Sasuke is more of a genius than what he was that age... and when he see's him, he realizes how stupid the people was to call him a genius in the first place.... Orochimaru is one of the most intelligence people in the manga mind you..
Itachi is someone with intelligence comparable to that of kakashi and Minato.. .AND ITACHI IS 21.....

Sasuke is too young at 16/17.... But he is progressing at a rate faster than any character in the manga... Give him a few more years and he will surpass his brother easily..



PS- What does wars have to do with this? We are talking about intelligence are we not?
And for your info, Minato fought in only 1 war... and died shortly after becoming hokage

Sasuke fought against 1000 ninja at once and defeated them all in his training with Orochimaru .. So I don't see your point... they can both defeat hundreds of fodder..

not that none of this matters in any case

[lol99]

oro knows about kirin so it is highly likely he helped sasuke with it and other jutsus [1]
plus doesnt sasuke always say teach me a new jutsu orochimaru, they work together [2]

[nickalfred31]

you think being hokage is a true testament to your strength in the village? An Uchiha Will NEVER BE Hokage..... Not when the daiymo and elders have certain criteria to follow to make the next hokage candidate...

Orochimaru already commented that Sasuke is more of a genius than what he was that age... and when he see's him, he realizes how stupid the people was to call him a genius in the first place.... Orochimaru is one of the most intelligence people in the manga mind you..
Itachi is someone with intelligence comparable to that of kakashi and Minato.. .AND ITACHI IS 21.....

Sasuke is too young at 16/17.... But he is progressing at a rate faster than any character in the manga... Give him a few more years and he will surpass his brother easily..

when one becomes hokage he knows more that gives him intelligence A LOT of intelligence. Oro called hm a genius because he was smarter than everyone in HIS own class/age. you dont think the 3rd hokage or jiraiya think minato wasnt genius at a young age also? You said 2 years to surpass minato's intelligence, its gonna take more than that.

[FTG V2]

wait wait wait, sasuke won againts bee? are yo serious? he got his ass handed to him, if he was by himself, bee would have been able to kill him.
Minato was the hokage, he knew things most of the people in the village didnt know. He freaking fought in wars. that gives him war and battle experiences. your logic is not relevent to "intelligence"

How hard is it to understand this? Sasuke and his team were fighting to capture Bee where as Bee didn't care about anything he even went full Bijuu and use TBB on Taka.

[sulanis]

No, Minato is smarter then Sasuke! Sasuke may have created kirin, but Minato created A LOT of techniques that require little chakra with no hand seals or time needed to build up chakra.

Sasuke is smart, but not on Minato's level

[FTG V2]

No, Minato is smarter then Sasuke! Sasuke may have created kirin, but Minato created A LOT of techniques that require little chakra with no hand seals or time needed to build up chakra.

Sasuke is smart, but not on Minato's level

Minato create Rasengan and FTG which i think was from his Clan, but the rest of his Techinques are from Tobirama.

[Owarij]

when one becomes hokage he knows more that gives him intelligence A LOT of intelligence. Oro called hm a genius because he was smarter than everyone in HIS own class/age. you dont think the 3rd hokage or jiraiya think minato wasnt genius at a young age also? You said 2 years to surpass minato's intelligence, its gonna take more than that.

Getting the title hokage doesn't give you intelligence...Tsunade is just as smart as she was before getting the title.... As I said before, The title hokage is only given to those who have had connections with the past hokage... and it wouldn't matter if Sasuke was the smarted and strongest in the leaf village by far.. He would never get the title because he was an uchiha...

Orochimaru wasn't commenting on the people in Sasuke's class. Orochimaru is saying that Sasuske is FAR more intelligent and far more capable than he ever was at age.... so much so, that looking at him makes him feel he wasn't deserving of the title "genius"....Remember that Orochimaru grew up to be the person the Third Hokage was going to choose for the hokage spot....but because to his inner sinister ways he chose Minato..

2-3 years to be on the intelligence level of kakashi,minato etc

[Kikki]

He might be very smart but he is immature and still way too young to get compared to Minato who was also a father and hokage with great responsibility. So yeah, Minato definitely outsmarts him for now.

[BlackDude]

my dear Sasuke kun

[Klaves]

Black Chidori was only used with Curse Mark and it was just something to look cool like Vermillion Rasengan. Sasuke doesn't know Black Lightning release. If he did he would implement it in his other lightning based jutsu, to improve their power. If he could do it with chidori as he wanted, we would have seen it again along with black lightning chidori true spear and/or chidori stream. The creation of jutsu is effected by intelligence, but it's more like the creative portion of their intelligence.

Minato predicted Naruto would grow to defeat Obito, which is inevitable. Minato was able to defeat Obito, and I'm not trying to use A>B>C but Sasuke not only can't defeat Obito, he had to be saved by Obito in multiple situations. Sasuke fights with rage, and rage leads his battle strategies to predictable directions. He rushed in the Kage Summit and almost died several times, saved by Gaara, saved by Obito. Sasuke isn't bad, but he isn't that good at keeping a level head. Cool heads prevail.

Minato has a cool head. Minato protected the village, sealed Kurama, and left a legacy for Naruto to follow. Even his Rasengan technique was perfectly engineered for Naruto and for his expansion on the tech with things like TBB Rasengan. He even made a fail-proof in the seal to stop Kurama from completely taking over Naruto during the fight with Pein.

Also Rasengan was much harder to create than Karin. Rasengan is change in chakra form, Kirin is just a large scale elemental jutsu. Rasengan can have multitudes of different versions that can implement change in chakra form and nature like Rasenshuriken. They can also be created and expanded without hand-seals. FTG also wasn't mentioned, and a space time jutsu as powerful as that outranks anything Sasuke has produced. Sasuke's strongest abilities are from the Sharingan and he customized one of them (blaze release).

[Owarij]

Black Chidori was only used with Curse Mark and it was just something to look cool like Vermillion Rasengan. Sasuke doesn't know Black Lightning release. If he did he would implement it in his other lightning based jutsu, to improve their power. If he could do it with chidori as he wanted, we would have seen it again along with black lightning chidori true spear and/or chidori stream. The creation of jutsu is effected by intelligence, but it's more like the creative portion of their intelligence.

Minato predicted Naruto would grow to defeat Obito, which is inevitable. Minato was able to defeat Obito, and I'm not trying to use A>B>C but Sasuke not only can't defeat Obito, he had to be saved by Obito in multiple situations. Sasuke fights with rage, and rage leads his battle strategies to predictable directions. He rushed in the Kage Summit and almost died several times, saved by Gaara, saved by Obito. Sasuke isn't bad, but he isn't that good at keeping a level head. Cool heads prevail.

Minato has a cool head. Minato protected the village, sealed Kurama, and left a legacy for Naruto to follow. Even his Rasengan technique was perfectly engineered for Naruto and for his expansion on the tech with things like TBB Rasengan. He even made a fail-proof in the seal to stop Kurama from completely taking over Naruto during the fight with Pein.

Also Rasengan was much harder to create than Karin. Rasengan is change in chakra form, Kirin is just a large scale elemental jutsu. Rasengan can have multitudes of different versions that can implement change in chakra form and nature like Rasenshuriken. They can also be created and expanded without hand-seals. FTG also wasn't mentioned, and an space time jutsu as powerful as that outranks anything Sasuke has produced. Sasuke's strongest abilities are from the Sharingan and he customized one of them (blaze release).

Minato predicted Naruto would grow to defeat Obito, which is inevitable

The sage frog predicted Jiraya's student would bring peace, Jiraya thought it was Minato...
Minato knew if he died that day, it would have to be naruto who would grow up to be Jiraya's student... Not much of a feat when your plan is based on a prophecy

Kirin is manipulation of natural lightning
Rasengan is just basic chakra moulding, something most ninja can do... the only trick is getting it to rotate...

[spade3dg]

Minato create Rasengan and FTG which i think was from his Clan, but the rest of his Techinques are from Tobirama.

Wtf. Since when did Tobirama teach Minato. He was dead before Minato was even thought of. Also he created FTG. If his clan did do you think that he would be their only prodigy. No.

Your not using your brain.

[Klaves]

The sage frog predicted Jiraya's student would bring peace, Jiraya thought it was Minato...
Minato knew if he died that day, it would have to be naruto who would grow up to be Jiraya's student... Not much of a feat when your plan is based on a prophecy

Kirin is manipulation of natural lightning
Rasengan is just basic chakra moulding, something most ninja can do... the only trick is getting it to rotate...

J-man also thought Nagato was the child of prophecy, and Minato might also have heard that. J-man becoming Naruto's mentor was not set in stone either. Everything had to happen just as it did for things to work out. The seal Minato used, J-man's loosening of the seal, and the 8 tails cloak being activated to in turn activate Minato's chakra within the seal. This is much more planning than Sasuke has put into any one plan. When you also consider Minato saved infant Naruto from Obito, hit Obito (which is a feat in its own), and removed Obito's control of Kurama along with sealing it within Naruto after he had used RDS to half Kurama's chakra, it becomes pretty evident that Minato's had the big picture in mind, and the prophecy was only the basis of the plan he built.

I don't recall seeing anyone other than the rasengan users molding pure chakra in their hands. Chakra control that they can use to run on water and other things like the Gentle Fist are different. There isn't any other non-elemental attack molded from pure chakra and held in the hand (even Jinton is not pure chakra since it is created from several elements), so molding pure chakra in a physical basis is only something rasengan users have done, let alone the rotation. Kirin manipulates natural lightning, which is cool, but water jutsu can manipulate natural water so elements being manipulated naturally is fairly common (much more common than people that have mastered rasengan). Also, it would be much more impressive if Karin was created from the user's chakra (in terms of creating the lightning itself instead of manipulating already existent lightning), like the rasengan.

[SasoriOfTheRedSaand]

At the moment? No. In the future? Definitely.

[Owarij]

J-man also thought Nagato was the child of prophecy, and Minato might also have heard that. J-man becoming Naruto's mentor was not set in stone either. Everything had to happen just as it did for things to work out. The seal Minato used, J-man's loosening of the seal, and the 8 tails cloak being activated to in turn activate Minato's chakra within the seal. This is much more planning than Sasuke has put into any one plan. When you also consider Minato saved infant Naruto from Obito, hit Obito (which is a feat in its own), and removed Obito's control of Kurama along with sealing it within Naruto after he had used RDS to half Kurama's chakra, it becomes pretty evident that Minato's had the big picture in mind, and the prophecy was only the basis of the plan he built.

I don't recall seeing anyone other than the rasengan users molding pure chakra in their hands. Chakra control that they can use to run on water and other things like the Gentle Fist are different. There isn't any other non-elemental attack molded from pure chakra and held in the hand (even Jinton is not pure chakra since it is created from several elements), so molding pure chakra in a physical basis is only something rasengan users have done, let alone the rotation. Kirin manipulates natural lightning, which is cool, but water jutsu can manipulate natural water so elements being manipulated naturally is fairly common (much more common than people that have mastered rasengan). Also, it would be much more impressive if Karin was created from the user's chakra, like the rasengan.

there are many cases where people mold chakra around a weapon to form the shape, eg asuma.. it's chakra manipulation... Sakura can do it and does it with her punches.... Without a doubt minato is smart.. but what he did that night was a gamble based on a prophecy...,You keep mentioning tobi like if that's a person you can compare to others..

Minato said it HIMSELF... . Unless you have a specific skillset of jutsu, he's not an opponent you can defeat..

Thank god he had a space time jutsu that was faster than tobi's , otherwise, what could he do? ....... Not being able to defeat tobi is no negative feat for Sasuke, as Naruto doesn't work in an abc Manner....

In a fight, Sasuke will be more than able to figure out that tobi materializes to attack and dematerializes to defend.. something even fu and torune figured out... But can he defend against it? Maybe not.....That means nothing....

[Frikid]

sasuke is intelligent but not to minato's level.

minato figured out obito's technique within 5 seconds.

[Klaves]

there are many cases where people mold chakra around a weapon to form the shape, eg asuma.. it's chakra manipulation... Sakura can do it and does it with her punches.... Without a doubt minato is smart.. but what he did that night was a gamble based on a prophecy...,You keep mentioning tobi like if that's a person you can compare to others..

Minato said it HIMSELF... . Unless you have a specific skillset of jutsu, he's not an opponent you can defeat..

Thank god he had a space time jutsu that was faster than tobi's , otherwise, what could he do? ....... Not being able to defeat tobi is no negative feat for Sasuke, as Naruto doesn't work in an abc Manner....

In a fight, Sasuke will be more than able to figure out that tobi materializes to attack and dematerializes to defend.. something even fu and torune figured out... But can he defend against it? Maybe not.....That means nothing....

Controlling chakra flow through the body like sakura's fists is just using the same chakra control that you would use to walk on water. She is simply building chakra up in her fists to increase her strength. That is not molding chakra, it is controlling the flow of it. The weapons like Asuma's knives are almost doing the same things as sakura's fists. The only differences are that it isn't part of the body and Asuma funneled wind chakra instead of pure chakra into the knives. This again is not chakra form. Nobody other than the rasengan users has actually created it outside of their bodies/weapons to manipulate it in a suspended state, alone in physical pure chakra form (Susano could possibly be considered pure chakra, but it is an inherited ability obtained from predetermined MS techniques, and doesn't seem to require much thought or effort other than strain from chakra use).

I was talking about Obito just to show how successful Minato's plans were against another highly intelligent shinobi. Minato's plan saved the present and the future. Sasuke's plans seem to only revolve around the present most of the time, and they seldom go smoothly or as planned. The attack on the Kage Summit was a horrible plan, and was about as far from intelligent as you can get. A would have killed him if it wasn't for Gaara, and Jinton would have killed him if it wasn't for Obito hax. It just seems like Sasuke's plans work out because he has to eventually fight Naruto, and he can't die until then. It just seems like the plot is keeping him alive much more than his own intelligence, where as Minato's intelligence kept him alive until plot killed him, forcing him to create a long term plan.