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  1. #41
    Mugiwara Pirate StraawHat's Avatar
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by Prometheus Beta View Post
    In a nutshell, the message you are trying to convey is that life is harsh and that it would be better if there were a virtual reality wherein you could have everything you desire?
    No my friend, what I am trying to say is that In life there are not enough people willing so sacrifice their integrity and everything else they may have in life to try and make this world a better place for everyone to live in
     
         

  2. #42
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by BenjerminGaye View Post
    It's like itachi san said "we all live in our convictions and what we believe to be real"
    The obito you know died under that rock and when he awoke he believed he was in the afterlife.He never let go of that notion and thinks that the world he currently resides in is "hell" due to rin's deaath.
    Maybe to him infinite tsuyokomi is his key to heaven because he thinks it will make everyone happy regardless of how they feel now since there in "hell" with him. For him this is redemption.
    It's not so much about Obito as it is about what he is actually doing, He lost everything in life and despite his actions he's still doing things to help people in a way he believes will save the world
     
         

  3. #43
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by kobak View Post
    The world still goes on.There have always been happy and unhappy people and always will. That's the way it goes.
    So what you're saying is you are satisfied with a world filled with winners and losers? what happens if you end up as the loser?
     
         

  4. #44
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pirate Hunter Zoro View Post
    The world belongs to no one, no one is the leader and no one is at the bottom. We as humans decided that, not some God. As the world grew older everyone just got more carefree, this generation is worse then the past one, and that past one is worse then the one before that, yes the world is continually decaying. But for it to be rescued, we must recue ourselves, someone else telling us won't allow us to realize anything. It's a really controversial topic and I could write an essay on it, but I don't have the time nor space.
    I see. Well I thank you for your opinion on the matter anyway but you are indeed correct. I think if we would realize our mistakes and try to set a better example for the next generation our world would become a better place, but in this world we live in today Hope is nothing but a delusion.
     
         

  5. #45
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    I have to disagree. What people fail to realize is it's not the things we do but why we do them. Obito is doing what he's doing purely from a selfish motive, he doesn't care about right and wrong his philosophy is a perverse version of what he said to Kakashi when they were young shinobi on the battle field arguing about whether or not if they should save Rin.
    But if you want my perspective on real world evil then I have to say the two most evil things in this world are hypocrisy and decisions made out of fear.
    We all have that dark version of ourselves in us, trying to hide it from the world lest they see us for what we really are. Humans are the only animal on this planet that has the hubris to think of itself in a higher regard than an animal, but that's all we are, intelligent yes, but animals nonetheless.
    I see people railing against the war on terror and how it's all about money and blah blah blah, but they weren't saying that when they were calling for vengeance on any Muslim nation that seemed responsible. No one gave a thought to how the people who had nothing to do with this atrocity would be affected, all most Americans wanted was an eye for an eye type of thing. Now I see all of these self righteous *******s out here railing against the government, corporations, etc; well we are just as responsible as they are.
    The world is ****ed because people (like 85% of the population) are ****ed. You buy shit you don't need so you can feel prestigious;
    you have kids to give your life meaning; you lie to yourselves about your very nature; and you put your faith in baseless lies, mythologies, corrupt politicians, pieces of paper which you would give your lives for, and you have the hubris to bring another human being into this world knowing full well that it's a fukking mess? Yeah the world is ****ed up, but only because the people are ****ing deluded sycophants.
    Sorry for the dark tone but that's how I honestly feel. It's almost foolish to hope but I see good in a lot of people. Maybe in another couple centuries we'll get it right. If not, I long for an asteroid to take this planet out. Cynical and pessimistic though it is.
     
         

  6. #46
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by PuppyDogGeneral View Post
    Sadly what's happening to this world...everything is becoming Ok. Just wait,Soon enough there will be bestiality and pedophilic rights under certain conditions...and a few years down the line, it will be generalized. I hope am dead by that time.
    We try and make things seem easier and better for other people by trying to make even the wrong things right, I have no problems with Homosexuals but I do not believe gay marriage should be allowed in a church but look what's happening, it's started to become a reality that we will all have to accept as modern day life whether we like it or not.
     
         

  7. #47
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Do you think kishi as the answer to world peace? That's pretty much where this manga is going. Ever since pain stepped in. Even before that but it wasn't as obvious.He has to write something for naruto to say to obito. Majority vote isn't a good answer due to the minority getting the short end of the stick, and on top of that if one sways people's mind then the vote becomes useless because their "will" was conditioned based off someone else's thoughts. Pain tried to use a nuclear deterrent and that's the current system the world uses today but like he said it would be a cycle of peace and war meaning war is soon to be upon us. Infinite tsuykomi seems like something out of the matrix but is not a true answer to those who believe they can tell whats real and whats not.... We still haven't heard naruto's answer though...Is it strife?the will to continue when all hope is lost?
     
         

  8. #48
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    This world is not slowly decaying, it is waxing and waning. It has it's good and it's bad. But, if you truly want to change it, I'll tell you what can be done.

    Everyone here is walking their own path, and I each person's path there is a split. The first road leads to a boring live, living by the rules, getting by with what you have and ultimately allowing this world to continue on with you chained to the world itself. The other path is different. It's a path where the individual can be free of all of their chains, and allow the individual to constantly define and redefine themselves. We won't be chained by an oppressive government who wants to make money over keeping its citizens safe. This road is built by us, as in all of us who choose the path, and it is traveled by the same individuals who built it. A wise man once said the best way to predict the future is to invent it. Let's invent it.

    If we all start right now, we could change this world into a better place is few years. But it will take all of us. Because the reality of our situation is that we are all slaves. We are chained to the world, chained to politics, chained to one another. But if we work hard, if we all help one another to break the chains that hold us captive, we can all be free. We won't be enslaved like our ancestors. We'll be free.

    Just like in the manga, we need to start an organization to make this world better. We'll call it akatsuki, for we will be the dawn of a new age. We may be called rebels, but what we are are freedom fighters, fighting for our future and the futures of the generations after us. Rise up with me my brothers and sisters, for we are going to invent the future. This is Syren. And I want to free the world.
     
         

  9. #49
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Alchemist View Post
    I have to disagree. What people fail to realize is it's not the things we do but why we do them. Obito is doing what he's doing purely from a selfish motive, he doesn't care about right and wrong his philosophy is a perverse version of what he said to Kakashi when they were young shinobi on the battle field arguing about whether or not if they should save Rin.
    But if you want my perspective on real world evil then I have to say the two most evil things in this world are hypocrisy and decisions made out of fear.
    We all have that dark version of ourselves in us, trying to hide it from the world lest they see us for what we really are. Humans are the only animal on this planet that has the hubris to think of itself in a higher regard than an animal, but that's all we are, intelligent yes, but animals nonetheless.
    I see people railing against the war on terror and how it's all about money and blah blah blah, but they weren't saying that when they were calling for vengeance on any Muslim nation that seemed responsible. No one gave a thought to how the people who had nothing to do with this atrocity would be affected, all most Americans wanted was an eye for an eye type of thing. Now I see all of these self righteous *******s out here railing against the government, corporations, etc; well we are just as responsible as they are.
    The world is ****ed because people (like 85% of the population) are ****ed. You buy shit you don't need so you can feel prestigious;
    you have kids to give your life meaning; you lie to yourselves about your very nature; and you put your faith in baseless lies, mythologies, corrupt politicians, pieces of paper which you would give your lives for, and you have the hubris to bring another human being into this world knowing full well that it's a fukking mess? Yeah the world is ****ed up, but only because the people are ****ing deluded sycophants.
    Sorry for the dark tone but that's how I honestly feel. It's almost foolish to hope but I see good in a lot of people. Maybe in another couple centuries we'll get it right. If not, I long for an asteroid to take this planet out. Cynical and pessimistic though it is.
    What you are saying is perfectly understandable and logical, I myself often battle with myself because I think that we have no right to label people good or bad based solely on their actions because you must understand fully the reasons why they did what they did otherwise we are just judging them for something they believe was right to do, I myself will not question the fact that I am only human but I have accepted myself for everything I am, I am an animal, I am nobody and in effect I am nothing, but isn't that what we all are? We are all the same so why is it that the ones who have the most riches are perceived and seen as more important than everyone else? We are all simply made and flesh and blood so what difference does it make? POWER, the thing that everyone is after. When I saw Naruto Chikara power, I saw it as more of symbolizing everyone's constant need of power, be it to protect or to destroy. I myself as I have said have nothing left to lose in life or nothing left to gain, for me the one thing I want to do is make the world a better place for everyone, I am not afraid to lay down my life for this dream, I am not afraid to make the decisions and choices that most people wouldn't, we all make decisions based on fear of being judged and having our backs turned on by our comrades and loved ones, but that is all a lie, words such as love are nothing but an illusion capitalized by the media which is why I believe that until everyone has faced the pain of losing everyone they loved cared about in their lives, then nothing will ever be done to help anyone.
     
         

  10. #50
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pirate Hunter Zoro View Post
    The world belongs to no one, no one is the leader and no one is at the bottom. We as humans decided that, not some God. As the world grew older everyone just got more carefree, this generation is worse then the past one, and that past one is worse then the one before that, yes the world is continually decaying. But for it to be rescued, we must recue ourselves, someone else telling us won't allow us to realize anything. It's a really controversial topic and I could write an essay on it, but I don't have the time nor space.
    I agree with everything you said except for the generationa thing. Look at our parents generation for example, those born in the late fifties early sixties; they did nothing. What revolution did they have? The revolution and counter culture of the sixties was started from those born in the forties and early fifties. The sexual revolution was going on while they were still kids and teenagers they had nothing to do with it. They became adults in the seventies and eighties and what came from those decades?
    Cocaine flooded the streets
    Gangs which started from the teenagers and young adults of the early sixties and seventies
    A.I.Ds/H.I.V
    the first recession
    Crack Cocaine, the list goes on. There is a reason they are called the lost generation and the generation without a cause. All they did was party, ****, and get high. We were on that path til the mid 1990s with our protest and desire for change. We are the ones who started the massive world wide protest of the rich and powerful. We need to give ourselves more credit, we are far better than our parents and we just might over shadow the accomplishments of our grand parents. Our parents lived in the generation of me, it's up to us to reform it and create the generation of "we".
     
         

  11. #51
    Mugiwara Pirate StraawHat's Avatar
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by BenjerminGaye View Post
    Do you think kishi as the answer to world peace? That's pretty much where this manga is going. Ever since pain stepped in. Even before that but it wasn't as obvious.He has to write something for naruto to say to obito. Majority vote isn't a good answer due to the minority getting the short end of the stick, and on top of that if one sways people's mind then the vote becomes useless because their "will" was conditioned based off someone else's thoughts. Pain tried to use a nuclear deterrent and that's the current system the world uses today but like he said it would be a cycle of peace and war meaning war is soon to be upon us. Infinite tsuykomi seems like something out of the matrix but is not a true answer to those who believe they can tell whats real and whats not.... We still haven't heard naruto's answer though...Is it strife?the will to continue when all hope is lost?
    No you misunderstand what I am saying, I said that even Kishi doesn't have an answer, I view him as a brilliant writerm but even he a brilliant writer doesn't have an answer, so who does have the answer? people who are seen as brilliant in their own fields could not come out with an answer because there is no answer! We all put our beliefs in false hopes because we all do not want to acknowledge the fact that we know in our hearts that there is no real answer to this, there is no such thing as peace because without war peace in itself means nothing. Yes, that system works but think how many innocent people have to die just so that the higher ups realize that they made a mistake? our world is run by deluded animals but even I cannot say that because before we make rash judgements about anything, we must fully understand the reasons behind said actions
     
         

  12. #52
    Senior Member BenjerminGaye's Avatar
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Alchemist View Post
    I have to disagree. What people fail to realize is it's not the things we do but why we do them. Obito is doing what he's doing purely from a selfish motive, he doesn't care about right and wrong his philosophy is a perverse version of what he said to Kakashi when they were young shinobi on the battle field arguing about whether or not if they should save Rin.
    But if you want my perspective on real world evil then I have to say the two most evil things in this world are hypocrisy and decisions made out of fear.
    We all have that dark version of ourselves in us, trying to hide it from the world lest they see us for what we really are. Humans are the only animal on this planet that has the hubris to think of itself in a higher regard than an animal, but that's all we are, intelligent yes, but animals nonetheless.
    I see people railing against the war on terror and how it's all about money and blah blah blah, but they weren't saying that when they were calling for vengeance on any Muslim nation that seemed responsible. No one gave a thought to how the people who had nothing to do with this atrocity would be affected, all most Americans wanted was an eye for an eye type of thing. Now I see all of these self righteous *******s out here railing against the government, corporations, etc; well we are just as responsible as they are.
    The world is ****ed because people (like 85% of the population) are ****ed. You buy shit you don't need so you can feel prestigious;
    you have kids to give your life meaning; you lie to yourselves about your very nature; and you put your faith in baseless lies, mythologies, corrupt politicians, pieces of paper which you would give your lives for, and you have the hubris to bring another human being into this world knowing full well that it's a fukking mess? Yeah the world is ****ed up, but only because the people are ****ing deluded sycophants.
    Sorry for the dark tone but that's how I honestly feel. It's almost foolish to hope but I see good in a lot of people. Maybe in another couple centuries we'll get it right. If not, I long for an asteroid to take this planet out. Cynical and pessimistic though it is.
    So you think consumerism and the need to reproduce is why where ****ed up? We have been practicing that since the dawn on time and I don't believe a thing will change. Its in our nature to want to reproduce were animals after all. the only difference is consumerism. Unlike all other animals humans have fallen out of balance with the world. If we are at the top of the food chain our numbers should be lower than those at the bottom and yet its the other way around, but that's due to advancements in technology and medicine. Can't blame us for wanting to extend our stay on this planet. Not that much people want to die.
     
         

  13. #53
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheSyren View Post
    This world is not slowly decaying, it is waxing and waning. It has it's good and it's bad. But, if you truly want to change it, I'll tell you what can be done.

    Everyone here is walking their own path, and I each person's path there is a split. The first road leads to a boring live, living by the rules, getting by with what you have and ultimately allowing this world to continue on with you chained to the world itself. The other path is different. It's a path where the individual can be free of all of their chains, and allow the individual to constantly define and redefine themselves. We won't be chained by an oppressive government who wants to make money over keeping its citizens safe. This road is built by us, as in all of us who choose the path, and it is traveled by the same individuals who built it. A wise man once said the best way to predict the future is to invent it. Let's invent it.

    If we all start right now, we could change this world into a better place is few years. But it will take all of us. Because the reality of our situation is that we are all slaves. We are chained to the world, chained to politics, chained to one another. But if we work hard, if we all help one another to break the chains that hold us captive, we can all be free. We won't be enslaved like our ancestors. We'll be free.

    Just like in the manga, we need to start an organization to make this world better. We'll call it akatsuki, for we will be the dawn of a new age. We may be called rebels, but what we are are freedom fighters, fighting for our future and the futures of the generations after us. Rise up with me my brothers and sisters, for we are going to invent the future. This is Syren. And I want to free the world.
    Yes I agree with some of what you're saying but tell me, who is willing to risk their lives to do something so bold? I know I am, i'll lay my life down on the line for everyone here, I may not know who you are but I don't even care, the fact is that you're all innicoent and have potential to create this future but we are all to scared to act upon this dream, if we could create some form of group to help save this planet and the people on it then count me in, I want to create a world where I know I have made it a better place for the future generation because only then can I die a happy man.
     
         

  14. #54
    Senior Member BenjerminGaye's Avatar
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by StraawHat View Post
    No you misunderstand what I am saying, I said that even Kishi doesn't have an answer, I view him as a brilliant writerm but even he a brilliant writer doesn't have an answer, so who does have the answer? people who are seen as brilliant in their own fields could not come out with an answer because there is no answer! We all put our beliefs in false hopes because we all do not want to acknowledge the fact that we know in our hearts that there is no real answer to this, there is no such thing as peace because without war peace in itself means nothing. Yes, that system works but think how many innocent people have to die just so that the higher ups realize that they made a mistake? our world is run by deluded animals but even I cannot say that because before we make rash judgements about anything, we must fully understand the reasons behind said actions
    So what do you think he is gonna make naruto say? He is the writer and peace is the will of his masters. He has to say something cuz then you cant condemn obito, or pein or sasuke for what they are doing.
     
         

  15. #55
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    nope obito is shit ...

    nagato knew the world better # 1

    & yeah the world sucks
     
         

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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by staticdash22 View Post
    Yeah, Obito is the "negative" naruto. What could have happened if he wasn't steered in the right direction. For Obito, it was the pain of losing someone you love. Rin was his "light" if you will, and after losing himself he didn't that that person who could be his voice of reason/stability. I thought it was symbolic when he was crushed under the rock holding Rin's hand, and then he told her to hurry and escape when meant he let go of his "light", his "hope". For naruto last chapter proved the prophecy of the old toad sage, he had a decision and obito almost talk no jutsu'd him which makes him exactly like naruto, they both can be somewhat convincing & inspiring. Naruto was waken up by hinata, who's name means "sunny place", so she's his light, and instead of forgetting the hand, he grabbed the "light" & the "hope" which was hinata's hand.

    Basically, Kishi is saying we can do either of two things. Submit and be weighed down by the world, or we can grab a hold of the light, the hope no matter how small it might be. Things in the world are bad, but the thing is, that things can be better, and it's a good start. It begins with us. sorry for the long analysis, just my thoughts.
    I like that...u r a really deep thinker...plus rep. Got me thinkin bout life...lol
     
         

  17. #57
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by BenjerminGaye View Post
    So what do you think he is gonna make naruto say? He is the writer and peace is the will of his masters. He has to say something cuz then you cant condemn obito, or pein or sasuke for what they are doing.
    Me? I think Naruto will tell everyone that even though he doesn't have an answer to peace, that it doesn't mean they should give up hope and keep fighting, while I agree with this it's also not something people can really apply in the real world
     
         

  18. #58
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by PuppyDogGeneral View Post
    Sadly what's happening to this world...everything is becoming Ok. Just wait,Soon enough there will be bestiality and pedophilic rights under certain conditions...and a few years down the line, it will be generalized. I hope am dead by that time.
    That sir is the dumbest thing I've ever read on this forum (and I've read a lot of dumb post). Pedophilic(that's not even a word ) rights? Bestiality? Someone has some dark fantasies don't they?
    Things like that are simply wrong, there is no pro to go against the con. You must be a christian who believes Satan and the anti-christ will one day rule the world, LOL! Well I don't believe that crap, man kind is ****ed up enough without needing a devil to make them bad. That right there is the very problem, we refuse to take responsibility for our actions. We blame everything but ourselves.
     
         

  19. #59
    Senior Member BenjerminGaye's Avatar
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    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    Quote Originally Posted by StraawHat View Post
    It's not so much about Obito as it is about what he is actually doing, He lost everything in life and despite his actions he's still doing things to help people in a way he believes will save the world
    That's what i'm saying he thinks what he is doing is right and true.But because it goes against the majority he is looked upon as a bad person. That happens almost every time you try to do something for yourself(unless those around you agree) If you truly believe it is right who's to call you wrong?
     
         

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    Jun 2012
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    65
    Only one can be the
    greatest... Guess who??
     

    Re: A Strange Question that needs views on.

    It's not any worse or any better than before, it's just that now we hear about what happens in the world because of internet etc, just because people didn't hear about it before didn't mean stuff didn't happen
     
         

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