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  1. #61
    In detention The God of Wind's Avatar
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by bl4ckJack View Post
    lol :D .. Nice Post .. agree agree
    IL IL later
     
         

  2. #62
    Member enuzuki's Avatar
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by The God of Wind View Post
    You cannot question someone's motivation. The reason being: We cannot see the heart of the person who may be doing something that we believe does not line up with scripture.
    I'm not saying we need a deep psychological analysis of his motivation, but a somewhat logical and dare i even say relatable. He could have made Obito's character without any form of association with a normal human being, but he didn't, he made Obito somewhat normal and to some extent relatable, that was so we would feel the pain he was feeling, or at least have some idea what he's going through, all of that is lost when he turns into something the boogeyman would check his closet for. Again he was with Madara for more then a decade, there are so many options it's not even funny. In my opinion he was a weak motivation to support a plot point.
     
         

  3. #63
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by enuzuki View Post
    I'm not saying we need a deep psychological analysis of his motivation, but a somewhat logical and dare i even say relatable. He could have made Obito's character without any form of association with a normal human being, but he didn't, he made Obito somewhat normal and to some extent relatable, that was so we would feel the pain he was feeling, or at least have some idea what he's going through, all of that is lost when he turns into something the boogeyman would check his closet for. Again he was with Madara for more then a decade, there are so many options it's not even funny. In my opinion he was a weak motivation to support a plot point.
    It's not that Kishimoto needs to do anything at all. You simply don't see it, too bad for you, because I and some other people do.....so don't know what to say to ya anymore :shrug:

    Good day
     
         

  4. #64
    Member enuzuki's Avatar
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by The God of Wind View Post
    It's not that Kishimoto needs to do anything at all. You simply don't see it, too bad for you, because I and some other people do.....so don't know what to say to ya anymore :shrug:

    Good day
    It's called self-interpretation, not everyone sees the same thing. I didn't implement anything, i read the material and stated what was there. What you did was read it and state what you saw. Going by what's there it's sorely lacking. That's my opinion anyways.
     
         
    Last edited by enuzuki; 01-04-2013 at 12:12 PM.

  5. #65
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by enuzuki View Post
    It's call self-interpretation, not everyone sees the same thing. I didn't implement anything, i read the material and stated what was there. What you did was read it and state what you saw. Going by what's there it's sorely lacking. That's my opinion anyways.
    Well if the writer found it sufficient and so did a lot of other people including me, than it isn't a matter of what you say, it's simply just missing the point.
     
         

  6. #66
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by The God of Wind View Post
    Well if the writer found it sufficient and so did a lot of other people including me, than it isn't a matter of what you say, it's simply just missing the point.
    What point? I never said that the there was no motivation. I said the motivation was weak. It's a matter of personal preference, you might think it's a sufficient motivation, but i don't.
     
         

  7. #67
    Senior Member Lilvic92's Avatar
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    People never ever seem to see the bigger picture, Obito's story and philosophy is too sophisticated for them.
    Good thread. The sig is not how I really view Obito's descent into darkness btw, it's all for laughs lol
     
         

  8. #68
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lilvic92 View Post
    People never ever seem to see the bigger picture, Obito's story and philosophy is too sophisticated for them.
    Good thread. The sig is not how I really view Obito's descent into darkness btw, it's all for laughs lol
    Incidentally your sig was the one who inspired me to do my poem :D
     
         

  9. #69
    Member enuzuki's Avatar
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lilvic92 View Post
    People never ever seem to see the bigger picture, Obito's story and philosophy is too sophisticated for them.
    Good thread. The sig is not how I really view Obito's descent into darkness btw, it's all for laughs lol
    You're comparing Obito with Anakin. That's a bit mean, Those prequels were terrible.
     
         

  10. #70
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by enuzuki View Post
    What point? I never said that the there was no motivation. I said the motivation was weak. It's a matter of personal preference, you might think it's a sufficient motivation, but i don't.
    Well, the fact that you see his best friends and beloved team mates(the ones he sacrificed himself for btw) killing each other off right in front of his eyes as insufficient reasoning for him to go nuts and hate his reality is sort of alarming. But whatever
     
         
    Last edited by The God of Wind; 01-04-2013 at 12:39 PM.

  11. #71
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Good post man. Gave me a lot of things to dwell on.
     
         

  12. #72
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thundercles View Post
    Good post man. Gave me a lot of things to dwell on.
    Hey thanks!
     
         

  13. #73
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by The God of Wind View Post
    Well, the fact that you see his best friends and beloved team mates(the ones he sacrificed himself for btw) killing each other off right in front of his eyes as insufficient reasoning for him to go nuts and hate his reality is sort of alarming. But whatever
    That should have been the base for a deeper development. It makes sense, after seeing that he would go back to Madara. Madara would start to change him from a naive good hearted boy, to who he is now. Sadly all we get is what should have been the foundation to a deeper and more interesting back story. If you're content with it all the more power to you, i just wanted to see more.
     
         
    Last edited by enuzuki; 01-04-2013 at 01:06 PM.

  14. #74
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by enuzuki View Post
    That should have been the base for a deeper development. It makes sense, after seeing that he would go back to Madara and Madara would start to change him from a naive good hearted boy, to who he is now. Sadly all we get is what should have been the foundation to a deeper and more interesting back story. If you're content with it, all the more power to you, i just wanted to see more
    That's why the chapter Rehabilitation is so important. We see his bonds developing with the Zetsu. We see him understanding Madara's ideology through them. He spends years in confinement with only half of his real body, trying to spruce up his artificial half enough to get out of there and finally go back to his friends. We see his hardship, his sole motivation being the left over memories of his team and Rin, which keep his hopes intact and his morale high. And then one day he finally makes it out, and the first thing he sees, is Kakashi stabbing Rin through the fukking heart and killing her on the spot. What the fukk more do you want?! I don't understand. That is much more than I expected.

    I didn't even mention the facts that he gave up his own life to protect them, and he'd have done it again. What's more, is that Kakashi swore to protect her while Obito was lying their crushed like a pea. And then he's the one that ends up killing her?! C'mon, thats just too much.
     
         
    Last edited by The God of Wind; 01-04-2013 at 01:22 PM.

  15. #75
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by The God of Wind View Post
    That's why the chapter Rehabilitation is so important. We see his bonds developing with the Zetsu. We see him understanding Madara's ideology through them. He spends years in confinement with only half of his real body, trying to spruce up his artificial half enough to get out of there and finally go back to his friends. We see his hardship, his sole motivation being the left over memories of his team and Rin, which keep his hopes intact and his morale high. And then one day he finally makes it out, and the first thing he sees, is Kakashi stabbing Rin through the fukking heart and killing her on the spot. What the fukk more do you want?! I don't understand. That is much more than I expected.

    I didn't even mention the facts that he gave up his own life to protect them, and he'd have done it again. What's more, is that Kakashi swore to protect her while Obito was lying their crushed like a pea. And then he's the one that ends up killing her?! C'mon, thats just too much.

    Again that is a foundation for a deeper story. Hell, the story that could've made here can be made into a manga in it self. It's a earth shattering thing to see, i would imagine. But for me it loses its impact when a character makes an complete 180. I would have liked to see him in torment and confusion over what transpired and then Madara would take advantage of his turmoil. Instead it's one event that shapes one event that changes him.(as far as we know)
     
         

  16. #76
    Member enuzuki's Avatar
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    I can both understand and appreciate your point of view. It's to bad you can't be objective enough to do the same.
     
         

  17. #77
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by enuzuki View Post
    I can both understand and appreciate your point of view. It's to bad you can't be objective enough to do the same.
    Indeed
     
         

  18. #78
    In detention The God of Wind's Avatar
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by enuzuki View Post
    Again that is a foundation for a deeper story. Hell, the story that could've made here can be made into a manga in it self. It's a earth shattering thing to see, i would imagine. But for me it loses its impact when a character makes an complete 180. I would have liked to see him in torment and confusion over what transpired and then Madara would take advantage of his turmoil. Instead it's one event that shapes one event that changes him.(as far as we know)
    Are you kidding?! Is there not enough torment and confusion in Hell? He is questioning his entire sense of reality while slaughtering everything in his path and not even realising it in a fit of rage! Some people are just harder to please than others I guess. >_>
     
         

  19. #79
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    Quote Originally Posted by The God of Wind View Post
    Are you kidding?! Is there not enough torment and confusion in Hell? He is questioning his entire sense of reality while slaughtering everything in his path and not even realising it in a fit of rage! Some people are just harder to please than others I guess. >_>
    "He is questioning his entire sense of reality". That's my point. When in that state Madara would be able to manipulate him easily. When he was in the cave he was adamant in his conviction and had none of the same ideology as Madara. I just wanted more of a good thing. I'm not saying he's a bad character, what i'm saying is his motivation isn't nearly as strong as it could, or should be. I retract my earlier statement about wanting to see 5 chapters of back story. I want a whole manga dedicated to it! The idea of it could easily make an 100 chapter manga. So no i still don't think Obito's motivation was developed enough. I would be great watching him slowly contemplate his way of thinking. I would like to watch him get trained, get sent to missions. But that would turn the focus way of the main plot. I guess he was a victim of a rushed story, having to make a concept in 1-2 days, draw it, do the backgrounds and ink it, really takes away from great concepts like Obito's story.
     
         

  20. #80
    Senior Member AWSUM SID's Avatar
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    Re: Why don't people understand?

    how many people were saved in the project tsukinome?? none.
    how many people died?? alot. i mean a war started literally.
    Will project tsukinome revive the dead? no. they will remain dead.
    What is good about deceit??
     
         

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