[Grand RP Tournament] Xmas Edition - Feedback and Discussion

[Lili-Chwan]

1st Bold WHICH IS WHYYYY im trying to tell everyone that canon only is the only way to show true skill. The constant is the jutsus the measurements are clear. I mean this is the perfect analogy that proves that canon only is the way to go. I thank you for this Lili. Anyway im not sure whether your trying to help me or what but whatever ill just keep reading.

@2nd paragraph/bold ah I see but this ALLLL goes back to what Gildarts said "customs are stronger than canon" this is an almost undenaible fact. Which ties back to what riku said "if you are evenly matched agaisnt an opponent using weaker techniques then the one using weaker techniques is more skilled" Im paraphrasing there but he certainly said that. As long as we agree on the premise that customs are indeed stronger than canon, your argument has no basis.

3rd bold. Ill quit rp'ing right here and now if you can find where i said that canons are weak. I'll give you my account too. Why in the world would I (a person who mainly uses canon) say that canon is weak?

4th bold want me to show you 10 WAY stronger customs? like i said we can go find the top 20 strongest canon and i guarentee you that if i find the top 20 custom that they will be stronger


5th bold YES it is. Doing more with less? Of course thats better. If i do exactly what you did with less tools OF COURSE im better


6th bold I think people are missing my point. What im saying is that if , like in your fight, someone has mainly used customs and the opponent has used canon to either evenly match, or make it super close. Then clearly the person who did it with canons should win.





No
Your grabbing straws and you know it. You can ALSO misuse a canon technique. But customs are stronger point blank.
So why didnt you just say yes when mig asked you lol

Alright then. I accept both your challenges. Let's start with the first. After you loose, I allow you to keep your bio and account until we settle the second. Moving on, your premise is, and I quote:

(...) customs are indeed stronger than canon (...)

Which means, correct me if I'm wrong, canon are stronger than customs, correct?

[-Broly-]

For all intents and purposes Le Broly is done arguing for the night. I'll pick it back up in the morning if I'm up to it but ill continue to read and maybe even post if I feel like it. However theres too many wallies goin on and I think Ive left enough material for people to think on

[Riku..]

Alright guys, really, you've all made your points and it's quite apparent that no one is going to give, you all have your opinions. This thread, however, isn't about customs vs. cannons, we simply discussed whether the use of them should or should not be part of the judging which is only a result of the question of three judges for each fight versus one. We as mods will discuss this later, though I can tell you that I for one am of the opinion that the mere usage of customs won't count against someone unless they're just spamming grossly Oped customs. The better strategist will be shown by their usage of what's at their disposal. Now to my belief most other mods are of a fairly similar opinion with slight alterations. I'm not saying this as a way to shut down your opinions on this, I'm only saying that being that the base is pretty decidedly split on this topic, so as mods we'll decide how we judge.

However this argument is getting the topic of this thread a bit skewed. So if you will, please move on to other topics about how to improve the tourney. This one is quite dried out I might say.

[-Broly-]

Alright then. I accept both your challenges. Let's start with the first. After you loose, I allow you to keep your bio and account until we settle the second. Moving on, your premise is, and I quote:



Which means, correct me if I'm wrong, canon are stronger than customs, correct?

And if they are does that mean that I said that canons are weak? One guy can lift 400 pounds, another can lift 380
the first one is stronger but is the other guy weak?
And yes you are wrong btw
I said customs are stronger
your saying canon are stronger

[Migualon J.J.]

...how about we stop this war between Custom and Cannon techs? I mean, this is supposed to discuss this tournament that ended, not talk about Cannon and Custom techs. so, let's just stop or take this to VM or PM or just create new thread for this topic if you really want to, i gave my opinion i am happy

[Aízen]

Make SO6P with juubi a tourney prize!

Dead serious BTW

[Gèckö]

Meh freeform is better anyways ._.
ot: small tournies for each generation

[Gildarts Clive]

The tournament was top notch, well done Scorps!

Make SO6P with juubi a tourney prize!

Dead serious BTW

Stop eating your sand mate.

[-Broly-]

Alright guys, really, you've all made your points and it's quite apparent that no one is going to give, you all have your opinions. This thread, however, isn't about customs vs. cannons, we simply discussed whether the use of them should or should not be part of the judging which is only a result of the question of three judges for each fight versus one. We as mods will discuss this later, though I can tell you that I for one am of the opinion that the mere usage of customs won't count against someone unless they're just spamming grossly Oped customs. The better strategist will be shown by their usage of what's at their disposal. Now to my belief most other mods are of a fairly similar opinion with slight alterations. I'm not saying this as a way to shut down your opinions on this, I'm only saying that being that the base is pretty decidedly split on this topic, so as mods we'll decide how we judge.

However this argument is getting the topic of this thread a bit skewed. So if you will, please move on to other topics about how to improve the tourney. This one is quite dried out I might say.

Indeed, as I said before the oldies tend to for some reason or another NEVER understand and the newer gen (or atleast I) will never understand them

[Aízen]

The tournament was top notch, well done Scorps!


Stop eating your sand mate.

Silence D- I mean Gildarts >_>

[Lili-Chwan]

And if they are does that mean that I said that canons are weak? One guy can lift 400 pounds, another can lift 380
the first one is stronger but is the other guy weak?

Well, weakness is relative. For all intends and purposes, we're pitting cannons against customs, thus, if one is weaker than the other, in the universe of Cannons and Customs, one is the strong one and the other is the weak one. You were the one who chose to generalize, and so, stick with your argument. In fact, in a debate where your whole argument is customs are stronger than cannons, one can only deduct that cannons are weak. If we want to enter in specifications, then you need to drop the very premise that "makes by arguments base-less".

Now, as for the list, please provide it, and I'll respond to them. Not here, since Riku closed the subject. I'd love to discuss it somewhere else, but I don't really know where to put this topic. Maybe in the Rules and Info section?

[-Broly-]

Well, weakness is relative. For all intends and purposes, we're pitting cannons against customs, thus, if one is weaker than the other, in the universe of Cannons and Customs, one is the strong one and the other is the weak one. You were the one who chose to generalize, and so, stick with your argument. In fact, in a debate where your whole argument is customs are stronger than cannons, one can only deduct that cannons are weak. If we want to enter in specifications, then you need to drop the very premise that "makes by arguments base-less".

Now, as for the list, please provide it, and I'll respond to them. Not here, since Riku closed the subject. I'd love to discuss it somewhere else, but I don't really know where to put this topic. Maybe in the Rules and Info section?

As you said, weakness is relative. One doesnt have to be weak and one doesnt have to be strong. When your view is narrowed to the view where you only see black and white, north and south, and never the area in between you get the view that i believe you currently have. When you open your eyes and see that not only did i not type down the words "Canon is weak" which you said that i said. And which I said that you could not find me saying (which you cant because i never typed that and your resorting to twisting words around) but you will also see that customs are simply stronger. Theres no argument or debate there. Ill find 10 and vm them to you with links or something.

[Lili-Chwan]

As you said, weakness is relative. One doesnt have to be weak and one doesnt have to be strong. When your view is narrowed to the view where you only see black and white, north and south, and never the area in between you get the views that i believe you currently have. When you open your eyes and see that not only did i not write down the words "Canon is weak" which you said that i said. And which I said that you could not find me saying (which you cant because i never typed that and your resorting to twisting words around) but you will also see that customs are simply stronger. Theres no argument or debate there. Ill find 10 and vm them to you with links or something.

. To answer to your previous question, yes, the guy that can only lift 380 pounds is weak. For him to be strong, we need to throw a third person in the mix, who lifts say 300. Then he is the weak, and the others are the strong. You didn't type the words "Cannon is weak", but if you didn't believe that, then there wouldn't be a debate, because we'd all agree, as I do, that customs and cannons are the same "strength", it's the skill in using them that changes. So, if a person is pressing the other, customs or not, then he is the better fighter if, and only if, he can sustain that situation longer than his opponent. If one is using cannons to defend but can't turn the flow around, then he is a weaker fighter, though cannons, unless he is using more chakra to defend than the opponent is using to attack, are pretty much renewable, so it's likely that he can turn things at the end.


I suggest, for the next tournament, that we keep the no loosers bracket method. I like the sense that you need to win everything in order to get prizes.

[-Broly-]

. To answer to your previous question, yes, the guy that can only lift 380 pounds is weak. For him to be strong, we need to throw a third person in the mix, who lifts say 300. Then he is the weak, and the others are the strong. You didn't type the words "Cannon is weak", but if you didn't believe that, then there wouldn't be a debate, because we'd all agree, as I do, that customs and cannons are the same "strength", it's the skill in using them that changes. So, if a person is pressing the other, customs or not, then he is the better fighter if, and only if, he can sustain that situation longer than his opponent. If one is using cannons to defend but can't turn the flow around, then he is a weaker fighter, though cannons, unless he is using more chakra to defend than the opponent is using to attack, are pretty much renewable, so it's likely that he can turn things at the end.


I suggest, for the next tournament, that we keep the no loosers bracket method. I like the sense that you need to win everything in order to get prizes.

Actually no your wrong but I see what your trying to do. In a comparative way you COULD say he is weak but you could also say he's not as strong as the first man. You can also simply say that the first man is stronger than the other. Which is very different from saying he's weak. Same thing here. Customs are stronger than canon, and yes there is no debate on that. I dont feel like typing it for the 10000th time but i know you can make the rest of the connections from that to what nagato and riku said.

@bold you think that customs and canon are the same strength. Is this what the desire to defend something untrue has brought you to believe? Or is this a lie to save face? We'd all like to live in the world where "an unskilled person with a kunai can be defeated by a skilled person with a pebble" oh yeah we'd love to believe that and sometimes we fool ourselves into believing that its true. But life's not like a manga, and its not a fairy tale. Things arent like that.

Theres no use arguing the rest of it with you because the fundamental premis of our understanding (whether or not customs are stronger than canon) is different. Therefore it is impossible to build an understanding on anything else

I'm kind of iffy on the losers bracket, the fact that the 3rd place winner of the last tourny was from the losers bracket makes me want one though. Also you can see that a loosers bracket is succesful because he beat the very same person that put him out the 2nd time around.

[Riku..]

~_~ Everyone needs to have the last word... I'll ask you both again, please drop it on the customs; you're wasting your own time.

[Lili-Chwan]

Actually no your wrong but I see what your trying to do. In a comparative way you COULD say he is weak but you could also say he's not as strong as the first man. You can also simply say that the first man is stronger than the other. Which is very different from saying he's weak. Same thing here. Customs are stronger than canon, and yes there is no debate on that. I dont feel like typing it for the 10000th time but i know you can make the rest of the connections from that to what nagato and riku said.

@bold you think that customs and canon are the same strength. Is this what the desire to defend something untrue has brought you to believe? Or is this a lie to save face? We'd all like to live in the world where "an unskilled person with a kunai can be defeated by a skilled person with a pebble" oh yeah we'd love to believe that and sometimes we fool ourselves into believing that its true. But life's not like a manga, and its not a fairy tale. Things arent like that.

Theres no use arguing the rest of it with you because the fundamental premis of our understanding (whether or not customs are stronger than canon) is different. Therefore it is impossible to build an understanding on anything else

I'm kind of iffy on the losers bracket, the fact that the 3rd place winner of the last tourny was from the losers bracket makes me want one though. Also you can see that a loosers bracket is succesful because he beat the very same person that put him out the 2nd time around.

Can't wait for your vm to actually prove you wrong then.

Well, what happens to the person of the winners batch who lost on the semi finals?

[-Broly-]

Can't wait for your vm to actually prove you wrong then.

Well, what happens to the person of the winners batch who lost on the semi finals?

Dont hold your breath

Whatever happened to them in the last tourney I suppose

[Lili-Chwan]

Dont hold your breath

Whatever happened to them in the last tourney I suppose

You're not going to send me a list of the top 20 customs?

In a single-elimination tournament, they fight each other for the 4th and 3rd. What happens in Looser's bracket?

[-Broly-]

Its almost 11 pm, so not today no

Whatever happened in the last grand tourney lol

[Gèckö]

Lilly wins simply because
Nami>Broly

[Gildarts Clive]

Lilly wins simply because
Nami>Broly

[Nagato..]

Liliana wins simply because, Apple pie.

[General.]

Liliana wins simply because, Apple pie.

Hmmm
I say broly win because of.. PUMPKIN PIE!

OT: The loser bracket was meh. dont care for it much.. But I think tournys like these should be held often.. to keep the rp going

[Typhon]

Hmmm
I say broly win because of.. PUMPKIN PIE!

OT: The loser bracket was meh. dont care for it much.. But I think tournys like these should be held often.. to keep the rp going

I don't think the activity level of the RP should be reliant on these tournaments. These should be more of an aside. Also too frequent tournaments would lead to an over abundance of some of the prizes.

Thats one thing I would like changed in the next one, a smaller prize pool. Im just a little worried that things like this coupled with village tournies might make things like curse marks or sound or EIG far too common when they're supposed to be rare.

[Nagato..]

I don't think the activity level of the RP should be reliant on these tournaments. These should be more of an aside. Also too frequent tournaments would lead to an over abundance of some of the prizes.

Thats one thing I would like changed in the next one, a smaller prize pool. Im just a little worried that things like this coupled with village tournies might make things like curse marks or sound or EIG far too common when they're supposed to be rare.

Dude I swear I said the same thing the other day. Tournaments are kind of handing out prizes like candy. I hear alot of peoplebrag about all the kinds of powerups they are going to get inside their villages and I kind of get upset at the fact people base there RP productivity over relying on cheap village prizes. Everyone and their momma has sound release and Curse Marks now. I really think we need to speak to the mods or Nexus and have some of these village tournaments and such postponed for a while for things to balance out.