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  1. #61
    Lost Artist veggetta13's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by ItachiStyle View Post
    Onoki is supposed to be much older than Tsunade... Tsunade is meant to be 50 at the start of the manga... and about 55 now. The ages don't match, but hey, just keep ignoring the evidence and repeating lame one liners.
    there we go, I agree. thing is we are doing stupid math cuz of Kishi...trolling for d pure joy of it. He can change it a 1000 times and it´ll still be right
     
         

  2. #62
    Member ANBUITACHIUCHIHA's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarutobi Sasuke View Post
    Figuring out that shouldn't present any significant problems:
    • Tobirama became Hokage after Hashirama died
    • Tobirama created the Acadamy during his reign as Hokage.
    • Hashirama died before the acadamy came into existence
    • Tunade was 6 when she graduated from the acadamy and became a genin under Hiruzen.
    • Tsunade must have been at the acadamy for a minimum of one year. So, she was a maximum of 5 years old when she entered the acadamy.
    • Tsunade was a minimum 2 years old when Hashi was still alive.




    Conclusion?
    • Hashirama died when Tsunade was between the ages of 2-5.
    • Tsunade is 54 years old
    • Hashirama died 49-52 years before the present!!

    the 2nd hokage and the 1st hokage were both alive when the 3rd hokage 1st became hokage. meaning the 1st was alive well after the 2nd became hokage.their were multiple hokages in power at the same time as we seen with the 4th and the 3rd
     
         
    Last edited by ANBUITACHIUCHIHA; 02-06-2013 at 09:50 AM.

  3. #63
    Senior Member Sarutobi Sasuke's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by ANBUITACHIUCHIHA View Post
    the 2nd hokage and the 1st hokage were both alive when the 3rd hokage 1st became hokage..their were multiple hokages in power at the same time as we seen with the 4th and the 3rd
    Your saying that the 1st AND 2nd Hokages were still alive when Hiruzen became Hokage? That doen't make any sense at all. Where is this coming from? I'd really like to see how you got to the conclusion that Hashirama was still alive when Hiruzen became Hokage.

    Anyway, the First Data book states that Tobirama became Hokage after Hashirama died. So Hashirama was definitely dead before Hiruzen became Hokage.

    We know for a fact that Tobirama died the day he made Hiruzen Hokage. If both the first two hokages were still alive just before that moment, what happened to Hashirama? According to your reasoning Hashirama could only have died after Tobirama. That makes no sense at all.

    Also Hiruzen and Minato were not Hokages at the same time. Hiruzen retired and Minato became Hokage. When Minato died, Hiruzen came back out of retirement.
     
         
    Last edited by Sarutobi Sasuke; 02-06-2013 at 10:11 AM.

  4. #64
    IKSOKRIPS = X-O-Creeps IKSOKRIPS's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarutobi Sasuke View Post
    Figuring out that shouldn't present any significant problems:
    • Tobirama became Hokage after Hashirama died
    • Tobirama created the Acadamy during his reign as Hokage.
    • Hashirama died before the acadamy came into existence
    • Tunade was 6 when she graduated from the acadamy and became a genin under Hiruzen.
    • Tsunade must have been at the acadamy for a minimum of one year. So, she was a maximum of 5 years old when she entered the acadamy.
    • Tsunade was a minimum 2 years old when Hashi was still alive.




    Conclusion?
    • Hashirama died when Tsunade was between the ages of 2-5.
    • Tsunade is 54 years old
    • Hashirama died 49-52 years before the present!!

    I already figured out Hashirama's death (you can check out my Timeline, there isa link in my Sig), but the latest chapter shows that Tsunade was born when he was still alive, which makes some problems, but it does fit the Timeline. :y :shrug:
     
         

  5. #65
    Senior Member Sarutobi Sasuke's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by IKSOKRIPS View Post
    I already figured out Hashirama's death (you can check out my Timeline, there isa link in my Sig), but the latest chapter shows that Tsunade was born when he was still alive, which makes some problems, but it does fit the Timeline. :y :shrug:
    Holy fck dude. You must have had quite a lot of time on your hands there. + Rep for sheer effort. I'm impressed.

    You do realize, however, that your timeline says that Tsunade was born 5 years after Hashirama died? And if you've read the latest chapter then you'll also realize that, thats impossible.
     
         

  6. #66
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Guys, Kishi already messed up people's ages back in chapter 599. When it comes to ages, Kishi fails. But since Kishi said that Hashirama knew Tsunade, we have to assume they met.
     
         

  7. #67
    IKSOKRIPS = X-O-Creeps IKSOKRIPS's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarutobi Sasuke View Post
    Holy fck dude. You must have had quite a lot of time on your hands there. + Rep for sheer effort. I'm impressed.

    You do realize, however, that your timeline says that Tsunade was born 5 years after Hashirama died? And if you've read the latest chapter then you'll also realize that, thats impossible.
    That's the thing man, I can't edit the thread anymore!
     
         

  8. #68
    Member ANBUITACHIUCHIHA's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarutobi Sasuke View Post
    Your saying that the 1st AND 2nd Hokages were still alive when Hiruzen became Hokage? That doen't make any sense at all. Where is this coming from? I'd really like to see how you got to the conclusion that Hashirama was still alive when Hiruzen became Hokage.

    Anyway, the First Data book states that Tobirama became Hokage after Hashirama died. So Hashirama was definitely dead before Hiruzen became Hokage.

    We know for a fact that Tobirama died the day he made Hiruzen Hokage. If both the first two hokages were still alive just before that moment, what happened to Hashirama? According to your reasoning Hashirama could only have died after Tobirama. That makes no sense at all.

    Also Hiruzen and Minato were not Hokages at the same time. Hiruzen retired and Minato became Hokage. When Minato died, Hiruzen came back out of retirement.


    what is the 3rds age compared to tsunades. we know for a fact that tsunade was alive when the 1st was.. in the anime they show the 1st hokage and 2nd hokage both telling the 3rd hes gonna be hokage
     
         

  9. #69
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Hiruzen is in his late 60's at the start of the manga supposedly, and Tsunade just entering her 50's. That makes sense with everything else we'd seen (until this F#$% up), because that would put Hiruzen in his mid 20's when he was training the Sannin as kids (which is how old he looks with Goatee, etc). This new timeline makes no sense, because Tsunade is suddenly almost as old as Hiruzen.
     
         

  10. #70
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Names himself Itachistyle.

    Makes a post more like "Narutostyle".

    Please delete this username.
     
         

  11. #71
    Member ANBUITACHIUCHIHA's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by ItachiStyle View Post
    Hiruzen is in his late 60's at the start of the manga supposedly, and Tsunade just entering her 50's. That makes sense with everything else we'd seen (until this F#$% up), because that would put Hiruzen in his mid 20's when he was training the Sannin as kids (which is how old he looks with Goatee, etc). This new timeline makes no sense, because Tsunade is suddenly almost as old as Hiruzen.
    its a stretch but not unbelievable itachi would of been a great teacher even tho hes 21
     
         

  12. #72
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    What are you on about...

    you're just making s**t up for the sake of being antagonistic.

    I can just see you now reading the chapter. It was designed to entertain but ONLY you get so angry over a panel like "> : (" KISHI!!! MY DAY IS RUINED NOW! YOU SUCK AT WRITING MANGA IM GONNA GO AND DO BETTER! OH WAIT NO IM NOT.
     
         

  13. #73
    ヽ(`Д´)ノ︵ ┻━┻ Kirin Rei's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by ItachiStyle View Post
    I'm wrong? Interesting... see peope said "I must not read the manga", but when called upon to provide the page number (thus proving me wrong, and covering themselves in glory), nobody has stepped forward. Should I be expecting an apology or retraction soon? I won't hold my breath.
    What on earth is wrong with you?
    All throughout the thread you have opposed just for the sake of opposing.

    I'm not sure what you want, but you want proof that Tsunade and Hashi knew each other, don't you?
    Doesn't the fact that Hashirama stated he taught her gambling in the latest chapter prove it?

    As for the timeline:

    Let's say Tsunade was around 2 years old in Hashi's flashback.
    Hiruzen was probably in his late teens at that time, around the current age of Naruto.
    If we bunch in the date of Tobirama being given the Hokage title together with the occurances above, all is fine.

    Once we take Tsunade's Academy graduation age into account, which is 6, there's a good 4 year time span where Tobirama could have appointed Hiruzen as Hokage. Plus, any man has the possibility of growing a goatee after hitting bloody puberty, one doesn't need to be 30 years old to have some facial hair.

    Tobirama's list of feats could easily be accomplished in a year or two (although the timeline allows us to span it up to four).
    Look at Tsunade's feats in the last year:
    Konoha has undergone a devastating attack and has been rebuilt from scratch and they are now fighting a bloody WW.
     
         

  14. #74
    Senior Member Sarutobi Sasuke's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by ANBUITACHIUCHIHA View Post


    what is the 3rds age compared to tsunades. we know for a fact that tsunade was alive when the 1st was.. in the anime they show the 1st hokage and 2nd hokage both telling the 3rd hes gonna be hokage
    Ohh, I see where this is coming from.

    I cant find that scene anywhere in the manga, maybe I'm not looking properly but I'm pretty sure you won't find it there either. But I do know that, that was a weird flashback Hiruzen was having in the anime. That was probably just some sort composite flashback. i.e. Two flashbacks in one. Anyway, thats all irrelevant since it comes from the anime. I'll assume that you know already that every now and then the anime decides to take initiative add their own ideas to the story. Which is why the anime is not considered cannon. That scene might be one of those times where the anime people made up their own stuff.

    Hiruzen is 18 years older than Tsunade. Which means that Hiruzen was 20-23 years old when Hashirama died, according to my timeline. In Hiruzen's anime flashback, he's portrayed as a very young boy (probably thirteen, give or take a few years). Read chapter 481 and you'll realize that Hiruzen was not a young boy when Tobirama declared him Hokage. Hashirama also was definitely also not present when Hiruzen was declared Hokage. Thats the sort of nonsense the anime sometimes comes up with every now and then.

    My advice to you is to disregard the anime and rely only on the Manga (and the databooks) for reference.

    Also, like I said before. The first Databook states that Tobirama became Hokage after Hashirama died.
     
         

  15. #75
    Member ANBUITACHIUCHIHA's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by Sarutobi Sasuke View Post
    Ohh, I see where this is coming from.

    I cant find that scene anywhere in the manga, maybe I'm not looking properly but I'm pretty sure you won't find it there either. But I do know that, that was a weird flashback Hiruzen was having in the anime. That was probably just some sort composite flashback. i.e. Two flashbacks in one. Anyway, thats all irrelevant since it comes from the anime. I'll assume that you know already that every now and then the anime decides to take initiative add their own ideas to the story. Which is why the anime is not considered cannon. That scene might be one of those times where the anime people made up their own stuff.

    Hiruzen is 18 years older than Tsunade. Which means that Hiruzen was 20-23 years old when Hashirama died, according to my timeline. In Hiruzen's anime flashback, he's portrayed as a very young boy (probably thirteen, give or take a few years). Read chapter 481 and you'll realize that Hiruzen was not a young boy when Tobirama declared him Hokage. Hashirama also was definitely also not present when Hiruzen was declared Hokage. Thats the sort of nonsense the anime sometimes comes up with every now and then.

    My advice to you is to disregard the anime and rely only on the Manga (and the databooks) for reference.

    Also, like I said before. The first Databook states that Tobirama became Hokage after Hashirama died.
    im happy you actually read my post and didnt go directly to slicing my head off.. maybe thats the issue i value too much of what the animes saying
     
         

  16. #76
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    It can't fit. Even ignoring the databook ages (as I'm happy enough to), which flatly contradict it, and ignoring the Manga (where Tsunade describes herself as entering her 50's, confirming the databook), we still have a teenage Hiruzen being made Hokage years after Hashirama died (he couldn't even recognise Saru when Edo'd originally), and not teaching the Sannin until he was an adult with a goatee and who had his face carved on the mountain. Frankly he looks more than just a few years older too, which again fits the previous chronology. There's just no way Tsunade's age can fit... she's 6 when Saru starts teaching her, so we're supposed to believe that at most 3 years have passed since:
    - Hashi's death
    - Tobirama's reign as Hokage, including the establishing of the police force, construction of the buildings and jail, etc, development of Konoha organisational structures, chunnin exams, etc, fighting in the wars, travelling to the Cloud for the peace treaty, being badly injured, recovering and travelling back from the cloud, having his face carved on the mountain, finishing Hiruzen's training, going on his final mission.
    - Conclusion of the first ninja war
    - Teen Hiruzen becoming Hokage.
    - Teen Hiruzen growing into an adult, having his face carved on a mountain, growing a goatee.

    That all happened in 3 years? Impossible.

    It's just annoying that a comic worth billions can't be organised enough to get some editors to look over Kishi's work in advance, and make sure he's not making such problematic timeline errors, which annoy fans.
     
         
    Last edited by ItachiStyle; 02-06-2013 at 01:04 PM.

  17. #77
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by ItachiStyle View Post
    It can't fit. Even ignoring the databook ages (as I'm happy enough to), which flatly contradict it, and ignoring the Manga (where Tsunade describes herself as entering her 50's, confirming the databook), we still have a teenage Hiruzen being made Hokage years after Hashirama died (he couldn't even recognise Saru when Edo'd originally), and not teaching the Sannin until he was an adult with a goatee and who had his face carved on the mountain. Frankly he looks more than just a few years older too, which again fits the previous chronology. There's just no way Tsunade's age can fit... she's 6 when Saru starts teaching her, so we're supposed to believe that at most 3 years have passed since:
    - Hashi's death
    - Tobirama's reign as Hokage, including the establishing of the police force, construction of the buildings and jail, etc, development of Konoha organisational structures, chunnin exams, etc, fighting in the wars, travelling to the Cloud for the peace treaty, being badly injured, recovering and travelling back from the cloud, having his face carved on the mountain, finishing Hiruzen's training, going on his final mission.
    - Conclusion of the first ninja war
    - Teen Hiruzen becoming Hokage.
    - Teen Hiruzen growing into an adult, having his face carved on a mountain, growing a goatee.

    That all happened in 3 years? Impossible.

    It's just annoying that a comic worth billions can't be organised enough to get some editors to look over Kishi's work in advance, and make sure he's not making such problematic timeline errors, which annoy fans.
    So, the only problem you have is that so many things happened in three to four years, not the chronology.
    It has been explained to you a million times yet you still choose to disregard it and stick to the claim that it doesn't fit.

    Konoha was completely rebuilt after the Pein Arc in quite a short time and you're still claiming that a couple of buildings, mountain art, one travel to Kumo, injury and recovery and some political devolopments are too much for four years...
     
         

  18. #78
    Senior Member Sarutobi Sasuke's Avatar
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Quote Originally Posted by ItachiStyle View Post
    It can't fit. Even ignoring the databook ages (as I'm happy enough to), which flatly contradict it, and ignoring the Manga (where Tsunade describes herself as entering her 50's, confirming the databook), we still have a teenage Hiruzen being made Hokage years after Hashirama died (he couldn't even recognise Saru when Edo'd originally), and not teaching the Sannin until he was an adult with a goatee and who had his face carved on the mountain. Frankly he looks more than just a few years older too, which again fits the previous chronology. There's just no way Tsunade's age can fit... she's 6 when Saru starts teaching her, so we're supposed to believe that at most 3 years have passed since:
    - Hashi's death
    - Tobirama's reign as Hokage, including the establishing of the police force, construction of the buildings and jail, etc, development of Konoha organisational structures, chunnin exams, etc, fighting in the wars, travelling to the Cloud for the peace treaty, being badly injured, recovering and travelling back from the cloud, having his face carved on the mountain, finishing Hiruzen's training, going on his final mission.
    - Conclusion of the first ninja war
    - Teen Hiruzen becoming Hokage.
    - Teen Hiruzen growing into an adult, having his face carved on a mountain, growing a goatee.

    That all happened in 3 years? Impossible.

    It's just annoying that a comic worth billions can't be organised enough to get some editors to look over Kishi's work in advance, and make sure he's not making such problematic timeline errors, which annoy fans.
    This is Hiruzen right after the Sanin became genin. Hiruzen is 18 years older than Tsunade who's 6 at this moment in the timeline. Which makes Hiruzen 24 years old in this pic.
    Tobirama created the academy Tsunade just graduated from in this pic, after becoming Hokage. Meaning Hashirama's already dead in the time of this pic.






    But then there's this pic. This occurs an unknown amount of time after Tsunade graduated from the academy. This is the day Tobirama's reign as Hokage ended.


    Is it just me or does Hiruzen seem younger?

    Maybe he shaved his goatee? I personally think Kishi messed up a bit.
     
         

  19. #79
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    Yeah screw it! the hokages are back t'is all that matters
     
         

  20. #80
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    Re: Kishi ruining the chronology on a whim

    to the thread maker ... how old do you think tsunade is in that picture id say 3-4 years old...how old is he now almost 60 ....so yeah i dont see a tmeline mis match here....sorry
     
         

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