Sasuke vs Tsunade

[ItachiStyle]

There is no evidence that Genjutsu doesn't work on Tsunade.

[Slug Princess Tsunade]

There is no evidence that Genjutsu doesn't work on Tsunade.

Chakra control counters the genjutsus. And Tsunade has perfect chakra control.

[TheTailedSage]

Chakra control counters the genjutsus. And Tsunade has perfect chakra control.

This ^^ jiraiya explains this principle

[Turson]

Chakra control counters the genjutsus. And Tsunade has perfect chakra control.

That is true, however Sasukes Genjutsu owned Shee, who is also a medic nin and Genjutsu user on top of that. Of course, Shee is not on Tsunades level, but considering how easily Sasuke disposed of him, Tsunade shouldnt feel all safe. She shouldnt look into Sasukes eyes, thats for sure.

[Slug Princess Tsunade]

That is true, however Sasukes Genjutsu owned Shee, who is also a medic nin and Genjutsu user on top of that. Of course, Shee is not on Tsunades level, but considering how easily Sasuke disposed of him, Tsunade shouldnt feel all safe. She shouldnt look into Sasukes eyes, thats for sure.

Well there is a difference between medical ninja and medical ninja. When Tsunade was 6, she already mastered every form of chakra manipulation. So basically the difference between them is as big as between Kurenai's genjutsu and Itachi's genjutsu.

[Turson]

Well there is a difference between medical ninja and medical ninja.

Thats why I said Shee isnt on Tsunades level. Still, considering how easily Sasukes Genjutsu pacificated Shee and left him unable to do anything for minutes, Tsunade shouldnt look into Sasukes eyes. It could cost her life.

[Boston Rob]

Of course Sasuke even Hebi Sasuke would give her a good fight

[shelke]

I am going to go out on a limb here, and say low difference even with Amaterasu restrictions. Here is why:

Sasuke can easily use arrows on Tsunade, who has no hopes of dodging them with her speed. In fact, not a single person except Kabuto has dodged them, but then DSM Kabuto's speed most probably is of the highest caliber in the entire manga. She won't be able to dodge them with her prowess. Sasuke can easily launch two arrows in succession, which means that she will get pinned down by two of them. Regenerating from such damage is difficult. This will certainly leave her completely immobile or inert for some time, and Sasuke can easily grab her and crush her completely.

Another is simple grab. Sussano arms were quick enough to Grab Kabuto's snakes in his DSM mode. I can't see how they won't be able to grab Tsunade at all. Sasuke can also put Tsunade under a Genjutsu which was powerful enough to shroud Bee's - a perfect Jinchurichi - reasoning for a couple of seconds. Tsunade might have perfect chakra control, but it would still take her a few seconds to disturb her chakra to snap out of Sasuke's genjutsu control. This is enough time to finish her off with a grab or an arrow straight to her head, taking her scull out completely. This won't leave any room for regeneration.

http://178.21.19.200/manga/mangas/Na...uidance/05.jpg - This image proves that Sasuke can use a silhouetted form of an incomplete Sussano with an arm in fast movements. He can use simple Taijustu to momentarily paralyze her with any Chidori variants like senbon or Nagashi and let his arm do the trick. Sasuke was actually fast enough to easily evade A at v1 and Bee V1 as well with 3 Tomoe Sharingan, henceforth, Tsunade won't prove to be much of a challenge.

If she brings out Katsuya for the fight, Sasuke can incapacitate it with genjutsu and turn it against her. A few acid spits on Tsunade herself will only end the battle quicker, and Sasuke being Encased in this silhouetted form of incomplete Sussano can evade both easily, and proceed to act on this plan. He can also get completely air-borne and take out Tsunade's Summon with genjutsu this way as well. From here, he can also use this aforementioned form of Sussano to grab her and end the fight.

These are just a few tactics I have at the back of my head. It clearly shows that even if Amatersau is restricted, Sasuke is quite out of her league.

[Tazzilla88]

Obviously she loses. She can' break Susanoo, she loses.

She doesn't really need to break it. Sasuke's Susanoo has no bottom she can just knock it over....

[Strict]

She doesn't really need to break it. Sasuke's Susanoo has no bottom she can just knock it over....

User of Susanoo can move freely inside it. The balance of Madaras Susanoo as it was used when Tsunade knocked it down is anyway worser, as feet have a smaller area than a Susanoo using its whole torso. Even Danzos Fuuton, that was backed up with Bakus suction didn't move Susanoo from its place by latter just clinging to the ground. Knocking it over wouldn't anyway change anything, as she won't leave any damage at Susanoo or Sasuke.

It's save to say, that Susanoo would crush Tsunade with a single punch to paste if hitting properly, the full skeleton already exceeds Tsunades strength and speed largely.

[-6 Paths-]

She doesn't really need to break it. Sasuke's Susanoo has no bottom she can just knock it over....

:lmao: Yeah, she'll just "knock the Susanoo over"

[TheTailedSage]

She doesn't really need to break it. Sasuke's Susanoo has no bottom she can just knock it over....

It doesnt work like that... I dont see how she would knock down this susano'o whn the susano'os movements dont depened on the users movements. The user can enter and exit the susano'o at will [1]; therefor this means that simple "knocking over the susano'o (especiallly one with no bottom) will prove quite difficult

[KidGamer65]

She doesn't really need to break it. Sasuke's Susanoo has no bottom she can just knock it over....

Susanoo is connected to his body movements and it is connected to him, she isn't knocking it over like she did Madara's. The only reason she could knock it over is because it had feet and could stand. Sasuke's envelopes him like a wall.

And what would knocking it over do? He could just get right back up, not like she would ever get a chance to knock it over as if she gets close enough Susanoo's arm will smash her just like it did Danzo.

[Champ]

Sharingan Sasuke owns her

[ItachiStyle]

It's completely absurd to claim chakra control somehow negates genjutsu. Many people with great chakra control have been affected by Genjutsu. Being a medic ninja in no way, shape or form renders you immune to genjutsu. The example of A's bodyguard has already been used. Chiyo was also an exceptional medical ninja, and said when she fought Uchiha, she avoided their eyes to prevent getting trapped in genjutsu. Rin was a medic ninja, and got trapped in genjutsu. Kabuto is a top ranked medic ninja, and he hid his eyes from Itachi to avoid the risk of genjutsu. Oro has great Chakra control, is an expert in all forms of jutsu, and was trapped in genjutsu. Sasuke and Killer Bee both have excellent Chakra control (though they are not Medic ninjas, that isn't the only way to have Chakra control), and they were not immune to genjutsu. The examples go on and on. It's a complete invention to say Tsunade is immune to genjutsu. With no evidence for it, she is just as vulnerable as everyone else.

Now of course, chakra control is part of helping to overcome genjutsu, but it's ludicrous to think Tsunade is going to easily get out of the highest level Genjutsu's we've seen on the back of being a medic. That's not consistent with how high level genjutsu has been portrayed in the manga, and if it was so easy then some of the eg's I cited above wouldn't be unfavourable to the idea.

[Slug Princess Tsunade]

Jiraiya was fully aware about the Sharingan genjutsus, yet he stated they can be broken with chakra control. And please, don't compare Tsunade with Rin and Shee, for example... She mastered every form of the chakra manipulation when she was a gennin ( 6 years old ).

[ItachiStyle]

Firstly, it says nowhere in the manga that she mastered chakra control at 6. Nowhere. And the manga is the only thing that's cannon, everything else is dubious, and to be treated as such. That lie annoyed me the first time I saw it, and it annoys me more now that you're repeating it. We have no idea at all how good Tsunade was at medical jutsu at age 6 (or even if she knew it).

Secondly, Jiraiya makes a general remark about genjutsu, however the practical application of genjutsu tells us it's not so simple. Otherwise Kabuto wouldn't be hiding his eyes from Itachi, despite being a top class medical ninja. And ... you know, all those other examples I gave.

[Slug Princess Tsunade]

Firstly, it says nowhere in the manga that she mastered chakra control at 6. Nowhere. And the manga is the only thing that's cannon, everything else is dubious, and to be treated as such. That lie annoyed me the first time I saw it, and it annoys me more now that you're repeating it. We have no idea at all how good Tsunade was at medical jutsu at age 6 (or even if she knew it).

Secondly, Jiraiya makes a general remark about genjutsu, however the practical application of genjutsu tells us it's not so simple. Otherwise Kabuto wouldn't be hiding his eyes from Itachi, despite being a top class medical ninja. And ... you know, all those other examples I gave.

1. It was stated in the manga, 'cause is stated in the databook too. And Kishi wrote the databook too.
2. The Tsukuyom, for example, i is a different story... I know that can't be broken with chakra control. I'm talking about the regular genjutsus and about the regular sharingan genjutsus.

[ItachiStyle]

1. It was stated in the manga, 'cause is stated in the databook too. And Kishi wrote the databook too.

Um, no. If it was stated in the databook, then it was stated in the databook. It doesn't mean it was stated in the manga too. It's also obvious that there is significant inconsistency between the databook and manga. From Itachi supposedly having the same genjutsu ability to Oro (both are scored an equal 5), to Ameratsu being described as "hot as the sun" (yet barely affecting Karin), to the recent timeline catastrophe (see the manga forum), which is even worse if one uses the databook ages and timeline (caused by the sudden desire of Kishi to claim that Tsunade and Hashi knew each other, thus destroying the previous timeline by years). The databook was not written by Kishi, though he got input, and Kishi sometimes contradicts himself, so the idea anything Kishi ever looked over becomes cannon is ridiculous (Kishi clearly changed his mind about the relative strength of the 1st and 3rd Hokage, even if it was never explicit... likewise, the indirect remarks that Hiruzen "knew all jutsu in the leaf" are plainly wrong, even only going off the word of Kishi, because to take but a single example we're also told only the 4th and Jiraiya could perform Rasengan). When Kishi got input to the early databook, he hadn't even invented the idea of elemental balance, or how they fit into blood line abilities, etc, yet we're supposed to assume stuff that was written (by the same company for which Kishi works) is always valid, even when Kishi changes continuity frequently? (who could forget Gaara suddenly becoming a host like Naruto, clearly not what Kishi originally intended). Um, no. The databook is never to be cited reliably. Ever.

2. The Tsukuyom, for example, i is a different story... I know that can't be broken with chakra control. I'm talking about the regular genjutsus and about the regular sharingan genjutsus.

So you get to arbitrarily pick which genjutsu can be broken by Tsunade, and which can't, based off no evidence whatever. Sorry, it doesn't work that way. The evidence doesn't support you (see eg's above), and the fact that you love Tsunade is not an argument. Here's how feats work- if characters don't demonstrate said abilities... they don't get granted them.

[Venus]

Tsunade wins, no diff.

[Tazzilla88]

User of Susanoo can move freely inside it. The balance of Madaras Susanoo as it was used when Tsunade knocked it down is anyway worser, as feet have a smaller area than a Susanoo using its whole torso. Even Danzos Fuuton, that was backed up with Bakus suction didn't move Susanoo from its place by latter just clinging to the ground. Knocking it over wouldn't anyway change anything, as she won't leave any damage at Susanoo or Sasuke.

It's save to say, that Susanoo would crush Tsunade with a single punch to paste if hitting properly, the full skeleton already exceeds Tsunades strength and speed largely.

The center of gravity would just move up which only mean a blow to the torso wouldn't knock of his Susanoo the same is not necessarily true of a blow higher. His Susanoo like everything else can be tipped over. Silly. Also Danzo's futon was mean to cut not push. Difference. Also Danzo's fuuton's pushing power even with Baku's suction is likely not as great as Tsunade punch. Also, the reason knocking it over would screw sasuke is... well this.

Furthermore, with Katsuyu's acid being more concentrated than A's and Susanoo being completely unable to move the fortitude of it would be undermined by Katsuyu's acid making it much weaker. And much more like to break when Tsunade hits it.

[Champ]

Good bye Tsunade

[ItachiStyle]

Maybe she can regen from a puddle of blood? LOL. In fairness she can probably counter with her strength to some degree, and maybe even bust out a few times, she is crazy strong. But this is still a ridiculous fight... even without his best ability, Sasuke stomps.

[unorthodox]

only people who can defeat sasuke is

madara
obito
naruto

[Critique]

Sasuke high dif. Everyone's either overrating Sasuke or underrating Tsunade.