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  1. #1
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    how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    hey guys,

    there was a thread about orange mask obito vs. Danzo. everyone was for obito. when some was for danzo he said Koto Amatsukami -> make obito kill himself.

    But know i thinking about what if someone knows about koto amatsukami? and knowing its about the enemy is controlling you without knowing that you are under the genjutsu.
    but does fact that you know that the enemy might already control you and let you do things you would never do (suicide) make you snap out of KA? or just do nothing and overthink every action you gonna do. obito would have time for it while hiding in kamui dimension.


    one question is if this is even possible (making ka effectless)
    the other question is we dont really know if obito might know about shisuis ultimate genjutsu.(he knows pretty much stuff)

    same goes for itachi. he knows about koto amatsukami (fact) would he able to get out if ka?

    but even if this is possible: 1. you need good selfcontrol and good thinking. (always questioning and overthinking
    your actions.
    2.it will definitivly (is this the right word?) slow you down -> ka would be still usefull


     
         
    Last edited by AlexXx; 10-22-2013 at 07:47 PM.

  2. #2
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Sasuke counters it just with his presence
     
         

  3. #3
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Impossible.

    Danzo solos.
     
         

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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Koto is slow.

    Sharingan can see chakra.

    Obito goes intangible before KA can make contact.
     
         

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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Don't really know how effective KA is against other Doujutsu users. Having MS might be a really good thing even against KA.
     
         

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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlexXx View Post
    hey guys,

    there was a thread about orange mask obito vs. Danzo. everyone was for obito. when some was for danzo he said Koto Amatsukami -> make obito kill himself.

    But know i thinking about what if someone knows about koto amatsukami? and knowing its about the enemy is controlling you without knowing that you are under the genjutsu.
    but does fact that you know that the enemy might already control you and let you do things you would never do (suicide) make you snap out of KA? or just do nothing and overthink every action you gonna do. obito would have time for it while hiding in kamui dimension.


    one question is if this is even possible (making ka effectless)
    the other question is we dont really know if obito might know about shisuis ultimate genjutsu.(he knows pretty much stuff)

    same goes for itachi. he knows about koto amatsukami (fact) would he able to get out if ka?

    but even if this is possible: 1. you need good selfcontrol and good thinking. (always questioning and overthinking
    your actions.
    2.it will definitivly (is this the right word?) slow you down -> ka would be still usefull


    put a mirror in front of him? xD
     
         

  7. #7
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Just like any other genjutsu. It's nothing special



    Acupressure chakras are disturbed when it's used, so chakra sensing/reading ninjas could notice it
     
         

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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Draphsin View Post
    Koto is slow.

    Sharingan can see chakra.

    Obito goes intangible before KA can make contact.
    all people with speed and Sharingan can solo KA
     
         

  9. #9
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redemption View Post
    Don't really know how effective KA is against other Doujutsu users. Having MS might be a really good thing even against KA.
    Not really Itachi could do nothing against it
     
         

  10. #10
    Sweety!Get Mommy's Bazooka foxyladyland's Avatar
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    inner Sakura is the only counter
     
         

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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Danzo solos.
     
         

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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerkak View Post
    Not really Itachi could do nothing against it
    but itachi knows how it works. he know that something like suicide thoughts(or any other thoughts wich would benefit the enmy) will come across his mind. so he must hold himself back to not let the thoughts become actions.

    some complicated sh!t.

    maybe its like tsukuyomi. when the person is mentally strong and tank the 72 hours of torture.
     
         

  13. #13
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerkak View Post
    Not really Itachi could do nothing against it
    When edo? I am fairly sure he just took advantage of the situation to release himself from kabuto's control.
     
         

  14. #14
    第五生まれ Draphsin's Avatar
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by PainTotheEarth View Post
    all people with speed and Sharingan can solo KA
    Yeah I agree, he was just talking about obito at first, using him as an example.

    Sensors can avoid it as well.
     
         

  15. #15
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    There are many counters for KA.

    -Perfect Jinchuriki can counter it because when they have been hit, their chakra becomes disturbed and under the user's control. Bijuu can just disturb their chakra and wake them up.
    -Sharingan users can see through that genjutsu and break it.
    -You can create clones to confuse the user of who is the real one.
    -Powerful sensory ninjas can possibly sense their chakra being disturbed and just awake them selves.

    @Draphsin: There is no evidence that KA is slow. Rather its actually fast as seen Itachi made the crow use it on himself instantly.
     
         

  16. #16
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    I made a thread awhile back that supports the perfection that is KA.

    http://narutobase.net/forums/showthread.php?t=300443
    Quote Originally Posted by Draphsin View Post
    Yeah I agree, he was just talking about obito at first, using him as an example.

    Sensors can avoid it as well.
    I'm not refuting that KA can be sensed, but how exactly do they avoid it?
     
         

  17. #17
    Sweety!Get Mommy's Bazooka foxyladyland's Avatar
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlexXx View Post
    but itachi knows how it works. he know that something like suicide thoughts(or any other thoughts wich would benefit the enmy) will come across his mind. so he must hold himself back to not let the thoughts become actions.

    some complicated sh!t.

    maybe its like tsukuyomi. when the person is mentally strong and tank the 72 hours of torture.
    Kakashi was mentally strong and knew Tsukuyomi was a genjutsu , but that didn't stop his body from breaking down.
    Quote Originally Posted by Draphsin View Post
    Yeah I agree, he was just talking about obito at first, using him as an example.

    Sensors can avoid it as well.
    KA works without the victim noticing it.. You wont know when its working probably like the other victims didn't until it was over.. If he tells you he's about to KA you then you might know its being done, but you could be thinking the kind of thoughts you usually think and not realize its KA's influence. :D
     
         

  18. #18
    第五生まれ Draphsin's Avatar
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Madara Rules View Post

    @Draphsin: There is no evidence that KA is slow. Rather its actually fast as seen Itachi made the crow use it on himself instantly.
    1. Build up of chakra (sfx. ooze)

    2. [TOP] Further build up of chakra (sfx. trickle), this is the window where sensors/sharingan users are able to act before KA is cast.

    3. [BOTTOM] Activation, yes the activation is fast, maybe as fast as tsukuyomi, however there is still a build up & chakra still needs to be transferred from one eye to the other.
     
         

  19. #19
    Sweety!Get Mommy's Bazooka foxyladyland's Avatar
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Draphsin View Post
    1. Build up of chakra (sfx. ooze)

    2. [TOP] Further build up of chakra (sfx. trickle), this is the window where sensors/sharingan users are able to act before KA is cast.

    3. [BOTTOM] Activation, yes the activation is fast, maybe as fast as tsukuyomi, however there is still a build up & chakra still needs to be transferred from one eye to the other.
    KA doesn require eye contact as seen by Danzo against Mifune.. maybe... since his eye was covered up..
    although maybe since those were white bandages he could see through them a little.
    but Itachi's KA used eye contact because he programmed it to activate when his MS did... for Sasuke.
     
         

  20. #20
    第五生まれ Draphsin's Avatar
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by foxyladyland View Post
    KA works without the victim noticing it.. You wont know when its working probably like the other victims didn't until it was over.. If he tells you he's about to KA you then you might know its being done, but you could be thinking the kind of thoughts you usually think and not realize its KA's influence. :D
    I doubt that a KA user can hide their chakra being built up, this should be a sign that a jutsu is being cast.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unbiased King View Post
    I'm not refuting that KA can be sensed, but how exactly do they avoid it?
    Avoiding the users line of sight

    Chakra still needs to be transferred from one eye to the other, this chakra can move through objects but it is still a dojutsu, it still needs to transfer chakra from one eye to the other in order to work.

    Izanami is the only exception to this rule & its been explicitly stated.

    Quote Originally Posted by foxyladyland View Post
    KA doesn require eye contact as seen by Danzo against Mifune.. maybe... since his eye was covered up..
    although maybe since those were white bandages he could see through them a little.
    but Itachi's KA used eye contact because he programmed it to activate when his MS did... for Sasuke.
    Yes no direct eye contact, this doesnt mean that you can look at someones toes & they get trapped in KA.
     
         

  21. #21
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by foxyladyland View Post
    Kakashi was mentally strong and knew Tsukuyomi was a genjutsu , but that didn't stop his body from breaking down.
    maybe kakashi wasnt strong enough. i thought about naruto being icought by tsukuyomi.
     
         

  22. #22
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Draphsin View Post
    Yeah I agree, he was just talking about obito at first, using him as an example.

    Sensors can avoid it as well.
    this pretty much solod the thread.
     
         

  23. #23
    Yami No Kami Dimitri Rascalov's Avatar
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Draphsin View Post
    1. Build up of chakra (sfx. ooze)

    2. [TOP] Further build up of chakra (sfx. trickle), this is the window where sensors/sharingan users are able to act before KA is cast.

    3. [BOTTOM] Activation, yes the activation is fast, maybe as fast as tsukuyomi, however there is still a build up & chakra still needs to be transferred from one eye to the other.
    How about we choose Danzo who activated KA and even Chee couldn't sense it. KA is not slow.
     
         

  24. #24
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Madara Rules View Post
    There are many counters for KA.

    -Perfect Jinchuriki can counter it because when they have been hit, their chakra becomes disturbed and under the user's control. Bijuu can just disturb their chakra and wake them up.
    -Sharingan users can see through that genjutsu and break it.
    -You can create clones to confuse the user of who is the real one.
    -Powerful sensory ninjas can possibly sense their chakra being disturbed and just awake them selves.
    YES but the first thing you have to do is making clones before ka is casted.
    not sure if sharingan could break it.
     
         

  25. #25
    Sweety!Get Mommy's Bazooka foxyladyland's Avatar
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    Re: how to counter Koto Amatsukami ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Draphsin View Post
    I doubt that a KA user can hide their chakra being built up, this should be a sign that a jutsu is being cast.




    Yes no direct eye contact, this doesnt mean that you can look at someones toes & they get trapped in KA.
    KA can make the Sensor stop sensing though. :D

    I know.. u_u we'll see more about it once Shisui comes back though
    Quote Originally Posted by AlexXx View Post
    maybe kakashi wasnt strong enough. i thought about naruto being icought by tsukuyomi.
    Tsukuyomi actually works for a short amount of time it the Tsukuyomi world when its cast on Perfect Jins
     
         

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