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  1. #1
    Member Whiteknight's Avatar
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    That last coffin

    I re-read chapter 490 again trying to figure out who was in that last coffin. There are really two categories of people it could be:

    1. People who are more powerful than Madara. Considering that Kabuto doesn't really know what Madara's real power levels are (and now that Madara has the Rinnegan) this is a *very* small list of historical people. This could also be people with particular kekkei genkai that Madara is particularly weak against. In this case, the exact person doesn't matter so long as they are more powerful than Madara is. Some people who we know are strong enough to have defeated Madara in battle are off-limits: Hashirama, Tobirama, and Minato.
    2. People whose body or existence pose an existential threat to Madara or his plan. This could be like a weird trick, somebody who knows an important secret about Madara, somebody who has a special relationship with him, or somebody who was able to stop his plan. This could also be a person whose very existence reveals a secret about Madara. For instance, if we said "Madara's real body", just existing would reveal a secret about Madara that would hurt his plans. This would have to be somebody very specific.

    It's either somebody with more power than Madara, or somebody with a secret edge over Madara. Here are two examples: In the first case, the person could be the Sage of the Six Paths, clearly powerful enough to defeat Madara in combat. In the second case, it could be the "Madara's real body" theory that people keep talking about. If it were Madara's real body, people like Zetsu would realize that Madara was lying about who he was, and Zetsu may stop helping. This would destroy Madara's plan.

    Read 490 again. Madara looks scared. He's frightened, shocked, startled. He's about to attack Kabuto and stops in his tracks. And beyond that, Kabuto acts like he has power over Madara. Kabuto's trump card is so important that Madara "Cannot refuse" him. Cannot. No choice. No recourse. Read the text again:

    Madara: What if I say no?
    <Kabuto summons the coffin>
    Madara: !?
    Madara: Tha...That's!!!
    Kabuto: Did you really think I would extend my hand to you without a backup plan?
    Kabuto: ...You cannot refuse me!
    Madara: You madman...How did you do this?
    Kabuto: Oh, you know. Relax, I haven't told a soul.

    In that last frame, you can see Madara's eye is very wide. He's scared. This is big.

    It's somebody that Madara is desperately afraid of. He's so scared that instead of fighting Kabuto he agrees to work together with him and offer to give Sasuke over to him after the war. We don't know what Madara's ultimate plans for Sasuke are, but I think Sasuke is pretty valuable. This is a big deal.

    The line where Kabuto says "Relax, I haven't told a soul" is pretty telling. This suggests that it's a matter of a secret, not just a matter of power. Everybody knows that the So6P is more powerful than Madara. That's not a secret, and even if other people knew it wouldn't matter: Knowing that a dead person is more powerful than Madara only helps an Edo Tensei user. If Kabuto told Kakashi "The Sage of the Six Paths is more powerful than Madara", what can Kakashi do with that information? Nothing.

    Considering that Kabuto treats this like a secret, I think we have to rule out the "power" options: The So6P and his children, other random powerful ninjas, etc.

    However, if it's a secret kind of person, maybe Kakashi would take that information and be able to develop a plan. I'm only using Kakashi as an example person here, of course. If Kabuto says "I know a secret. I have Madara Uchiha's real body in a coffin. Therefore, this is not Madara". Somebody like Kakashi or Naruto would find that information very valuable: Suddenly they know that this person, Tobi, is not Madara and does not have the power that Madara was supposed to have (no EMS, for example). That would help them formulate a better battle plan. That's the kind of secret that Madara would be afraid of.

    So let's start looking at a list of candidates:

    1. Madara's real body. This really does seem like the best option, considering the evidence I point out above. I don't think I would bet money on it, but this does seem the most obvious. I don't know if Kishi will go with something obvious.
    2. Obito: This doesn't make sense. Obito was not powerful, didn't know anything about Madara, and his existence doesn't reveal anything about Madara.
    3. Izuna: Izuna has MS, so he would be a power threat to Madara. Of course, Itachi has MS too, and Madara isn't afraid of Itachi when Kabuto summoned him. Madara doesn't seem like the kind of person who would let his emotions get in the way of his plan, so I don't think he will go easy on his younger brother anyway.
    4. Shuisui: Shuisui did have a unique hypnosis technique that Madara has expressed an interest in gathering for himself. This doesn't seem like something that would scare Madara though, or something that would force him to negotiate with Kabuto.

    Another option is that the person in the coffin was somehow related to Zetsu, and was able to stop/kill/control Zetsu and therefore would be able to stop Madara's plan. I don't know who it would be, but Kabuto does seem to know a lot about Zetsu. Withou Zetsu, Madara's plan is dead.

    So that's my analysis of the coffin. I offer two guesses, based on the information we have: Either it is Madara's real body, or it is somebody who hasn't been in the manga yet who is able to stop or ruin Madara's plans.
     
         

  2. #2
    Senior Comedian Member -The Agent-'s Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    I think Tobi=Kagami or Shisui and the Coffin=Madara. Those are just my off the wall opinions.

    Great post and great read.
     
         

  3. #3
    RIP Mystogan Sharingdork's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    very well thought out. good job. while shisui's ability can make Madara say something that he wouldn't otherwise (in theory. or maybe just give Kabuto control over him like his other reanimated corpses) he sais himself that he cannot bring Shisui back because he doesn't have his DNA. but still, Madara's real body is a good guess, but i'd say that it's a character we haven't met yet.
     
         

  4. #4
    Senior Member Modaro's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    Nice post but I think it just stated alot of the obvious.

    Zetsu isn't a human he was made by madara down in the secret base that he showed Kabuto. Madara is also made up of zetsu cell that was shown when madara went in to a room with zetsu spore and reattached his hand.
     
         

  5. #5
    ~Is KiNd To EvErYoNe~ 0oo The Fallen Angel oo0's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    UR point No.2 Has possibilities the one at the starting
     
         

  6. #6
    Academy Student FaTman801's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    if it is Madaras real body, how does the fake one (Tobi) have a sharigan if Itachi wiped out the entire Uchiha clan?

    Other than that good gueses.
     
         

  7. #7
    Egyptian sinbad's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    Quote Originally Posted by Modaro View Post
    Nice post but I think it just stated alot of the obvious.

    Zetsu isn't a human he was made by madara down in the secret base that he showed Kabuto. Madara is also made up of zetsu cell that was shown when madara went in to a room with zetsu spore and reattached his hand.
    in wich chapter zetsu reattached madra's arm ???
     
         

  8. #8
    ~Is KiNd To EvErYoNe~ 0oo The Fallen Angel oo0's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    Quote Originally Posted by FaTman801 View Post
    if it is Madaras real body, how does the fake one (Tobi) have a sharigan if Itachi wiped out the entire Uchiha clan?

    Other than that good gueses.
    first of all welcome to Nb friend and secondly I think u dont read the naruto manga more carefully
     
         

  9. #9
    ~Is KiNd To EvErYoNe~ 0oo The Fallen Angel oo0's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    Quote Originally Posted by sinbad View Post
    in wich chapter zetsu reattached madra's arm ???
    true i have the same question
     
         

  10. #10
    Senior Comedian Member -The Agent-'s Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    Quote Originally Posted by 0oo The Fallen Angel oo0 View Post
    true i have the same question
    Tobi's Arm looks more like Kakuzu's arm, They harden the same way.





    ^ Those two incidents. Kakuzu and Tobi's arm hardened the same way. Kakuzu did say he fought the first Hokage, just like Madara. Maybe he repaired Madara's body after he lost to Hashirama.
     
         

  11. #11
    Jinchurikki Hokage Fradio's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    It could be Madara's brother or Danzo i think...
     
         

  12. #12
    Senior Comedian Member -The Agent-'s Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    Quote Originally Posted by Fradio View Post
    It could be Madara's brother or Danzo i think...
    How could it be Danzo? He's long gone.
     
         

  13. #13
    Economical Truth kisamexRocks's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    It's not Obito, the whole time frame doesn't make any sense what so ever.
    It's not Shisui since Shisui's body was never found by Kabuto nor was any of his DNA.
    I personally don't think it's Izuna because Izuna died when he had no eyes but had jutsu, and an Uchiha's strong link is their eyes. So he might be pretty much useless.

    I don't think it's Madara's body. It might be a ninja we don't know about or something like that but now Tobi = Madara unless proven other wise.

    All Zetsu is, is a life support for Madara, replaces his lost limbs and probably keeps him young due to their DNA similarities as Zetsu is a creation of Madara and Hashirama.
     
         

  14. #14
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    Re: That last coffin

    rikudou sennin!
     
         

  15. #15
    I &lt;3 PIE!!! ~Naruto&Itachi~'s Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    tobi is izuna
     
         

  16. #16
    Senior Member Modaro's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    Quote Originally Posted by sinbad View Post
    in wich chapter zetsu reattached madra's arm ???
    Quote Originally Posted by Modaro View Post
    Dude I don't know how much good this will do but, I don't think madara is a zetsu replacement. Maybe he is made up of spare parts zetsu put together. Because I remember zetsu feed on or collect dead bodies so maybe he uses parts to help heal madara.


    look what ever he is doing here.
    It is at this moment he reattaches an arm after it was lost in his battle with danzou's men. Look at the his surroundings it looks like the projections zestu makes when he appears also the globyness he makes when he splits. NO it is not because zetsu is coming because zetsu appears a short while after here with his own projections, and globyness intact, on the side of his face.

    If you look carefully the projections and globyness is to the front of madara and zetsu appears to the back of madara with smaller projections and in the pic after that some globyness can be seen in front of madara where zetsu isn't.

    The hand which he attaches is all slimy and uncovered unlike his other body parts. Which is why i believe that this body isn't madara's but his soul is just animating the body.

    "I am just a shell of my former self"
    Meaning what u see before u isn't the real me it is just a representation of me.

    I'M SO DAMN COOL

    Does this answer your question ?
    Oh an Zetsu didn't put Madara had back Madara did with his own zetsu spore/cells because zetsu clearly shows up after madara reattaches his arm.
     
         

  17. #17
    Member kanesannin's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    Ok , first of all try to realize that kishimoto's VERY fond of making the reader think in one way(in this case: Madara's shock) and then later revealing reality to be something else entirely.......e.g NOBODY would have honestly guessed itachi was on konoha's side in the beginning part of the manga. So you can't use expressions( back then someone could have said sasuke was terrified, itachi was hard and cruel,etc so he could'nt be looking out for sasuke) to justify your opinion. Apart from that pretty good thread, most of it is at least backed up by the manga.
     
         

  18. #18
    Egyptian sinbad's Avatar
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    Re: That last coffin

    hey Modaro why madra on this pic have whiskers like the one naruto have?
     
         

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