[Discussion] Tobi's/Madara'a MS a copy?

[UnclePimpzEX]

It occured to me that some people are speculating whether or not Tobi/Madara has an EMS or any MS for that matter. But recently watching some old anime i rembered that within the old uchiha meeting room under the tanaka carpet thing sasuke learns of a secret.

That to control the kyubbi u need the MS, so how is it that Tobi/Madara 16 years ago tamed the beast for a while, if he supposedly doesn't have a MS?

Now my second point, obviously we think Tobi is not not actually Madara, he doesn't have medical ninjutsu like tsunade, to keep him young, so what then is keeping him alive?

Remember in the anime where nagato was cloning pains, they showed a room where it perfectly copied the rinnegan, well what if there are clones of madara each with a space time warp ability but some with MS and others with just tomoes.

It sort of far fetched but have we ever thought as to where nagato actually got the technology to clone his pains? Perhaps Madara behind the scenes gave him the idea to do so in order to comply with the six paths?

Again this is just speculation and hypothesis, so plz discuss

[UzUmAkiiClaN]

when he controled the tail beast..at the time he already had takin his brother eyes.so therefore he was able to control the beast. (hopefully im not wrong lol)

Now i do have a speculation on how Madara has manage to survive all this years with out "dying"? or getting super old. lol

My theory is that since his able jump in to space. or should i say space gaps? not really sure but you can probably get the idea.
He might just had found the right gap in space that time travels slower then it would in regular time earth..

and thats most likely how he has managa to survive all this years..hiding himselft in "TIME" we can say.

it kinda make a little sense rite?

[Professor Sarutobi]

Remember in the anime where nagato was cloning pains, they showed a room where it perfectly copied the rinnegan, well what if there are clones of madara each with a space time warp ability but some with MS and others with just tomoes.

It sort of far fetched but have we ever thought as to where nagato actually got the technology to clone his pains? Perhaps Madara behind the scenes gave him the idea to do so in order to comply with the six paths?

Again this is just speculation and hypothesis, so plz discuss

Pain wasen't cloning anything, they were storage for the bodies when he wasn't using them.
The bodies were people from the rain village (j-man met them all while traveling around) that he killed and put rods into to use as paths, even with chakra controling them they'd still rot so he put them away, (probably some kind of freezer pods)

[Akaton]

space-time ninjutsu manipulates space and time

[UzUmAkiiClaN]

space-time ninjutsu manipulates space and time

that's the word i was looking for..i been off nb for a while

[SixthHokageSan]

no it's not a copy. he learn the MS by himself and he took his bro's MS and he got the enternal ms

[UzUmAkiiClaN]

no it's not a copy. he learn the MS by himself and he took his bro's MS and he got the enternal ms

that' s what i just told this guy lol..

[UnclePimpzEX]

It occured to me that some people are speculating whether or not Tobi/Madara has an EMS or any MS for that matter. But recently watching some old anime i rembered that within the old uchiha meeting room under the tanaka carpet thing sasuke learns of a secret.

That to control the kyubbi u need the MS, so how is it that Tobi/Madara 16 years ago tamed the beast for a while, if he supposedly doesn't have a MS?

Now my second point, obviously we think Tobi is not not actually Madara, he doesn't have medical ninjutsu like tsunade, to keep him young, so what then is keeping him alive?

Remember in the anime where nagato was cloning pains, they showed a room where it perfectly copied the rinnegan, well what if there are clones of madara each with a space time warp ability but some with MS and others with just tomoes.

It sort of far fetched but have we ever thought as to where nagato actually got the technology to clone his pains? Perhaps Madara behind the scenes gave him the idea to do so in order to comply with the six paths?

Again this is just speculation and hypothesis, so plz discuss

sry guys i forgot about da pods never mind then im stumpped to how he survived, oh and the copy part is that after was fighting 1 hokage, he was very injured so possibly could have cloned himself, sharingan and all to survive?

[EternalMangekyouRinnegan]

Tobi at the Danzou vs Sasuke fight told that with combined powers of sharingan and hashirama's dna you can control kyuubi, and that's exactly how he controlled it when he attacked konoha. There is a thread like this one made few days ago, go look it up.

[kisamexRocks]

Tobi is Madara, if his sharingan is lost because of Izanagi or because he controlled the fox, he has spare ones to use. But to be honest Madara is tobi and I think once you unlock the MS you don't have to have it activated to tame tailed beasts.

You don't need to have medical ninjutsu to look young. Examples are Kakuzu and Sasori. There is just different ways of making you young.

Nagato never clones bodies/pains he just was able to turn dead bodies into paths. I don't think that there are actual Tobi/Madara clones, would bea bit OP. So far the only legitimate clone is Zetsu. But Zetsu is always with Madara, every time. So if Madara is damaged and needs repair, he uses Zetsu since Zetsu is the creation of the Uchiha and Senju combined, so their DNA matches and is able to reproduce lost limbs.

[EternalMangekyouRinnegan]

Tobi is Madara, if his sharingan is lost because of Izanagi or because he controlled the fox, he has spare ones to use. But to be honest Madara is tobi and I think once you unlock the MS you don't have to have it activated to tame tailed beasts.

You don't need to have medical ninjutsu to look young. Examples are Kakuzu and Sasori. There is just different ways of making you young.

Nagato never clones bodies/pains he just was able to turn dead bodies into paths. I don't think that there are actual Tobi/Madara clones, would bea bit OP. So far the only legitimate clone is Zetsu. But Zetsu is always with Madara, every time. So if Madara is damaged and needs repair, he uses Zetsu since Zetsu is the creation of the Uchiha and Senju combined, so their DNA matches and is able to reproduce lost limbs.

http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/478/15

Tobi doesn't have ms, this was a fairly simple hint from Kishimoto to point out that fact. Im suprised some ppl couldn't understand that.
Tobi controled kyuubi with the combined powers of sharingan and shodaime like it's mentioned in manga not with ms. Actually Tobi never claimed or said he had MS or EMS. I don't know why you ppl say he has them, lol. Why do you think he needs Sasuke for? He want's his eyes, his ems to himself. And now when Nagato is dead, he also needs him for Gedo Mazo, but Tobi laid his eyes on Sasuke long before Nagato betrayed him so his only goal was to obtain Sasukes eye's.

Sasuke and Itachi were most talanted and gifted Uchiha of their time and their eyes are far superior than anyone else, they're unique.
Tobi himself said: For sharingan to activate susanoo is a rarity.
That's why he didn't killed of Itachi and Sasuke because they're eyes is exactly what he needs for his tainted plans.

Yes, Madara Uchiha had EMS but as you clearly see something happened after the fight with Hashirama and the Tobi guy, the reincarnation of Madara or to say better what's left of him never showed any signs of possesing MS or EMS.

Sorry for the mess but im to lazy to edit my posts now.

[kisamexRocks]

http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/478/15

Tobi doesn't have ms, this was a fairly simple hint from Kishimoto to point out that fact. Im suprised some ppl couldn't understand that.
Tobi controled kyuubi with the combined powers of sharingan and shodaime like it's mentioned in manga not with ms. Actually Tobi never claimed or said he had MS or EMS. I don't know why you ppl say he has them, lol. Why do you think he needs Sasuke for? He want's his eyes, his ems to himself. And now when Nagato is dead, he also needs him for Gedo Mazo, but Tobi laid his eyes on Sasuke long before Nagato betrayed him so his only goal was to obtain Sasukes eye's.

Sasuke and Itachi were most talanted and gifted Uchiha of their time and their eyes are far superior than anyone else, they're unique.
Tobi himself said: For sharingan to activate susanoo is a rarity.
That's why he didn't killed of Itachi and Sasuke because they're eyes is exactly what he needs for his tainted plans.

Yes, Madara Uchiha had EMS but as you clearly see something happened after the fight with Hashirama and the Tobi guy, the reincarnation of Madara or to say better what's left of him never showed any signs of possesing MS or EMS.

Sorry for the mess but im to lazy to edit my posts now.

I never said he had it, I simply said that I think if you unlock the MS, you don't have to have it activated in order to control beasts. Plus when he attacked Konoha 16 years ago he never used any Hashirama powers at all to control the Kyuubi, just his sharingan, but possibly had some type of DNA of Hashirama. If he has MS or EMS than he doesn't use it much for some reason, perhaps he used Izanagi to survive the encounter with hashirama at the Valley of the End and ever since he needed new eyes.

I personally believe this.

Tobi is Madara Uchiha, Lost his MS/EMS due to using Izanagi to survive his encounter with Hashirama Senju, Hid in the shadows, had some replacement sharingan somehow, and is using a huge stockpile of sharingan in order to by time or continue his plans until he gets his powers back.

[~Naruto&Itachi~]

Tobi at the Danzou vs Sasuke fight told that with combined powers of sharingan and hashirama's dna you can control kyuubi, and that's exactly how he controlled it when he attacked konoha. There is a thread like this one made few days ago, go look it up.

you only need the dna of a uchiha and the dna of any senju so a uzumaki and uchiha would work if sasuke gets the dna of tsunade it would work as well

[Akisha]

space-time ninjutsu manipulates space and time

lol this might be it but Im not sure...

[PositiveEmotions]

no he had control of the fox tails it was stated and i dont think he used ems tho but than again i could be wrong

[EternalMangekyouRinnegan]

you only need the dna of a uchiha and the dna of any senju so a uzumaki and uchiha would work if sasuke gets the dna of tsunade it would work as well

Im not talking about Izanagi here, to use that jutsu you need senju and uchiha powers but to control kyuubi you need specificly Hashiramas powers not Senju. Don't you remember that Yamato could supress kyuubi when Naruto would go rampage mode? Hashirama could somehow control him too, and if im not mistaken he actually had all of the tailed beasts in his control which he gave up to other nations as a sign of peace and trust.

I guess Hashiramas chakra/dna also acts as a booster to your own power because danzou had to use it not only to use izanagi but also so he could handle all eleven of his implanted sharingans. Maybe Hashiramas powers boost up regular 3 tomoe sharingan so much that it can control kyuubi without MS/EMS (as said in manga by Sasuke and confirmed by Itachi).

[~Naruto&Itachi~]

Im not talking about Izanagi here, to use that jutsu you need senju and uchiha powers but to control kyuubi you need specificly Hashiramas powers not Senju. Don't you remember that Yamato could supress kyuubi when Naruto would go rampage mode? Hashirama could somehow control him too, and if im not mistaken he actually had all of the tailed beasts in his control which he gave up to other nations as a sign of peace and trust.

I guess Hashiramas chakra/dna also acts as a booster to your own power because danzou had to use it not only to use izanagi but also so he could handle all eleven of his implanted sharingans. Maybe Hashiramas powers boost up regular 3 tomoe sharingan so much that it can control kyuubi without MS/EMS (as said in manga by Sasuke and confirmed by Itachi).

oh ya i went back over the manga and ya you are right

[BarBoBot]

Tobi at the Danzou vs Sasuke fight told that with combined powers of sharingan and hashirama's dna you can control kyuubi, and that's exactly how he controlled it when he attacked konoha. There is a thread like this one made few days ago, go look it up.

that was me that brought that up in the other thread, and you are correct that Tobi says that if you have a sharingan and the dna from Hashirama, you can control the nine tails.

Any senju dna + sharingan can use Izanagi.

[PositiveEmotions]

tobi/madara same person

[EternalMangekyouRinnegan]

tobi/madara same person

Until he comes out of the closet he's a cookie monster for me.

[PositiveEmotions]

lol cookie monster hahahaha he seems like a muffin monster to me idk why