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  1. #221
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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Omningan View Post
    I hope no one is forgetting that I brought this to the table...?? Feels that way.

    Anyways, I got some new stuff to share regardless of whether I will be credited with it.

    First...
    I am working under the assumption that Naruto already has something of the sage of the six paths... whether that be: he has it all, or whether: he only has a part of it, remains to be seen. The Kyuubi identifies something that Naruto is doing as the SO6P.
    Also, Naruto very much resembles the SO6P while in Kyuubi Mode.
    Both evidenced by these links.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/499/12
    Here he has the tomoe around his neck and he has the horns on his head.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/499/14
    Here, after Naruto locks the four element seal, and the Kyuubi is being locked away he desperately screams that "This is the sage of the six paths"

    In conclusion to that, you guys can discuss the sage's six paths as much as you like, but until you admit that Naruto has what the sage of the six paths had, you are on the wrong track.

    Now to identify what it is that Naruto has, that makes him the sage of the six paths, we have to define what we know about Naruto, which will lead us back to Rikudou Sennin.

    Thanks to Madara spilling secrets while stealing the Rinnengan from Nagato's dead body and from what he told Konan while killing her, we can divine that 2 of the paths are without question...
    1. Uchiha DNA.
    2. Senju DNA.
    These are without argument, two of the pieces necessary for the sage of the six paths.
    They are also two of the keys to being able to use Izangi, the third key being in possession of a sharingan. This we know, because it was also done by Danzo under different cirumstances.

    This Uchiha/Senju combination makes sense when we look at the Rikudou Sennin's sons. One lineage came to be Senju, the other eventually became Uchiha.
    So like I said, these are unquestionably 2 of the 6 paths.
    Moving on,
    Now we have to look for the other 4 paths.
    If we know for a fact that 2 are DNA based, and not based on a doujutsu.
    Its not the Sharingan, Its the UCHIHA DNA. Don't get it twisted.
    Then it stands to reason that its not the Rinnengan, its the Uzumaki DNA.
    "Perhaps Madara's EMS in some way evolved into the Rinnegan he gave to Nagato"
    I believe Danivass has what can be considered closest to the truth.
    This fits in with Madara saying that the Rinnengan was his, but we never saw him with it. It also fits in with the theory that Nagato was the FIRST to have the rinnengan since the Rikudou Sennin. If Madara had them originally, then Nagato wouldnt have been the first. It also makes sense as to why Madara would give up his EMS, he wanted to create the Rinnengan in the world again, and this was the only way. By combining his advanced sharingan with an Uzumaki, the Rinnengan was born into the world again.
    Then he was able to take his eyes back, newly powered up and get with them, his real goal, the Uzumaki DNA that he needed. I will repeat this so all of you understand...
    THE RINNENGAN IS JUST A DOUJUTSU. The DNA that it carries, is Uzumaki, thanks in large part to Nagato. I can make this easier for you to understand by using Kakashi as an example. He has the sharingan, but he is not an uchiha. The eye is just a doujutsu, it by itself is powerful, yes, but only with the correct DNA does it become even more powerful, as evidenced by Itachi, Sasuke, etc. Sasuke with regular eyes, and no sharingan was still a genius. Keep this in mind.
    This leads us to understand that the 3rd path that madara identifies when taking the rinnengan from Nagato is the Uzumaki DNA.
    To prove this to you, I will try once more, so pay attention.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/510/16
    If you look here, Madara is talking to Nagato's dead body and he says.
    "YOU are the third of the six paths" NOT "AH, the rinnengan the third piece of six"
    NOT "finally the rinnengan, i have the third path again!"
    NO NO NO
    he says "YOU are the third path of six."
    and then directly after that in the same dialogue he DROPS THE BOMB.
    "YOU TURNED YOUR UZUMAKI RED HAIR, WHITE!"
    This is where we learned the huge secret that Nagato was an Uzumaki.
    The reason it was explained here is because of the significance of the third path.
    Uzumaki DNA is the third path!
    And so help me god if another one of you argues me on this I'm gonna flame you so hard, you'll think you have explosive diarrhea...

    So now we can all agree wholeheartedly, right?, that
    1. Senju
    2. Uchiha
    3. Uzumaki

    Ok, thats three.
    Three left to go, and here's where it gets tricky...
    We have to assume that Naruto has the other 3. Something that naruto has in him, is the other 3. Lets see what we know about naruto. Naruto is a sage, one of the only sages ever, much like his master Jiraiya. There is something special about being a sage, a sage can posses and use the senjustu chakra. nature chakra. yellow chakra.
    to others, it is deadly and can petrify you if your internal powers arent enough to control it. even jiraiya would start to look like a toad and he trained with it for years.
    This fits in with the name of the Rikudou Sennin. He is the SAGE of the six paths.
    The Rikudou Sennin was a sage, he had nature chakra well under his control.
    He is accredited for being somewhat of a monk, someone at great inner peace.
    We know that Naruto's original training in senjutsu chakra was to obtain a great inner calm and peace of mind/body/spirit. This is another piece of the puzzle.
    We know that the first 3 pieces, uchiha, senju, and uzumaki are all WELL reknowned for their chakra abilities. The uchiha are masters of spirit chakra, the senju are masters of body chakra, and the uzumaki are masters of stamina chakra. (nagato, kushina, naruto) need I say more? So DNA/Chakra/Whatever seems to be the common key between the paths.
    1. Senju
    2. Uchiha
    3. Uzumaki
    4. Senjutsu

    5, I feel very confident in. 6, Im not so sure about...
    What else does Naruto have that the sage would have had?
    What do they have in common? Well, they were both Jinchuurikis right?
    And when did Naruto suddenly appear to have the qualities of the SO6P?
    The minute that he took in the chakra of the Kyuubi! Nothing else changed in that moment. One minute, he didnt have it, the next minute he had the final piece, Tailed Beast Chakra! Senju Chakra, Uchiha Chakra, Uzumaki Chakra, Senjutsu Chakra, AND FOR OUR FIFTH PIECE, TAILED BEAST CHAKRA!! TADA!! Confetti falls from the sky! The skies part and the way becomes clear! LOL.
    Now we have 5. GUARANTEED!

    1. Senju
    2. Uchiha
    3. Uzumaki
    4. Senjutsu
    5. Tailed Beast
    6. ??

    Here's where I'm not so sure...
    Lets keep looking at Naruto, what else does he have, that could be another chakra source, or another type of power?
    We know that Naruto has Wind Element Chakra.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/316/2
    For the longest time, he didnt even know it, maybe he didnt truly have it, as I believe you have to CREATE it with your own chakra. Which is why bloodline limits, and bloodline expansions are so amazing. Because the user is not just using his chakra to create 1 element, he is using his chakra to create, 2 or even 3 elements and then combining them! as evidenced here by Yamato.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/316/6
    By this we can deduce that Naruto has an entirely sperate chakra type from the 5 listed above, he has WIND ELEMENT. Which I believe to be the 6th and final piece of the sage of the six paths! I will list them one more time for you, and the order isn't important, its where they come from and what they represent that is important.

    1. Senju Chakra (I can pretty much guarantee you that Minato was Senju lineage.)
    2. Uchiha Chakra (We know that Itachi gave something to Naruto, and I believe its this, a piece of Uchiha, something he might not be able to get anywhere else)
    3. Senjutsu Chakra (Naruto trained really hard and worked diligently to become a sage, a master of nature chakra)
    4. Uzumaki Chakra (we know for a fact that Naruto's mother was Uzumaki)
    5. Wind Element Chakra (we know that naruto was capable of winde element, but until Kakashi identified it, and helped him learn to manifest and create it, it was not at his disposal)
    6. Tailed Beast Chakra (possibly the rarest form of chakra, not many can claim the title Jinchuuriki)

    So there you have it ladies and germs!
    The Six Paths that Naruto has, that Madara wants.
    I could be wrong, but it feels so right, I will stand by it until proven wrong.
    Feel free to comment, and hate, and even try to disprove me, I'll be happy to hear it.
    Just don't forget who told you!!!

    And one final thing before I go, I had no idea that Naruto was so steeped in Japanese Mythology. Look here for some VERY interesting reading about Susanoo, Izanagi, Tsukiyomi, and Amertasu. It seems Kishi is a man of many minds and talents.
    I'm very impressed.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susanoo
    "In Japanese mythology, Susanoo, the powerful storm of Summer, is the brother of Amaterasu, the goddess of the sun, and of Tsukuyomi, the god of the moon. All three were spawned from Izanagi, when he washed his face clean of the pollutants of Yomi, the underworld. Amaterasu was born when Izanagi washed out his left eye, Tsukuyomi was born from the washing of the right eye, and Susanoo from the washing of the nose."

    Theres also some interesting bits here.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Totsuka-no-Tsurugi
    It seems Orochimaru and the Kusanagi are all inspired from myth as well.

    ENJOY, MATES!!


    Great post Omningan! Seems you are right, 3rd path = Uzumaki. I think it is still very clear though, the rinnegan is essential to the full extent of the So6P's power. Yes, the 6 paths may not actually include any of the doujutsus, but those eye powers are essential to possessing the full extent of the Sage's powers.

    Yes the Kyubi expressing Naruto's similarity to the sage is essential but we have to keep in mind that it does not mean for certain that Naruto has so many paths. Lets look into a unique issue: How does the Kyubi actually know what the S06P was like? We have to assume that he saw the Sage after being split from the Juubi. If this is the case, then he saw the sage without any tailed beast chakra in him. Maybe Naruto simply looked like the sage did after having released the Jubi? Lets take a different route: Maybe all the Juubi's memories were forever contained in the individual 9 beasts? If that were the case, than without a doubt, the Kyubi would remember the sage and what he looked like. But again, he would not have known what the sage looked like with his power being used by him. My point? Perhaps Biju chakra is not actually a path but simply mimiks the power of the So6P? I suppose it is also possible that the Juubi was aware of what the So6P looked like while using his power and that is what the Kyubi was comparing Naruto to. If that is the case, than maybe Biju chakra is a path. From what we know, the Sage was definetly considered the So6P after containing the Juubi:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/467/14
    But we don't know for certain if he did in fact have all 6 paths before doing so.

    I don't want to make it seem like I'm discounting your ideas Omningan, but I am just trying to see things from different angles. As danviss talked about, the Juubi likely wasn't around for long if it had such power. Did it really exist naturally and only devastate the world when it wanted to? Maybe not..... Perhaps the sage created this massive beast somehow by using Izangi and later found it to be too powerful. Maybe thats why it was within his power to control it?? Because he created it!! (Sorry if someone has said this before but I don't remember hearing it) My point is that maybe he was the S06P before hand and the Biju's power was just an exaggerated extension of his own power? Just putting the idea out there, not trying to go against you Omningan.

    As for Senjutsu and Wind, Senjutsu chakra seems quite essential but just wind? That seems a little simple to be a path in itself, but I don't have any better ideas so more props to ya!
     
         

  2. #222
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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    Like another member posted earlier, I believe the Gedo Mazo statue, is the 10 tailed beast. Hence you need all nine tailed beast to power it up! Hence it takes so much chakra to summon it... and even more chakra to seal the beast chakra.

    I also believe the So6p sealed it somehow in the statue.. once it gets all the tailed beast chakra, the 10 tails will be reborn and break from the statue lol.
     
         

  3. #223
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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Omningan View Post
    I hope no one is forgetting that I brought this to the table...?? Feels that way.

    Anyways, I got some new stuff to share regardless of whether I will be credited with it.

    First...
    I am working under the assumption that Naruto already has something of the sage of the six paths... whether that be: he has it all, or whether: he only has a part of it, remains to be seen. The Kyuubi identifies something that Naruto is doing as the SO6P.
    Also, Naruto very much resembles the SO6P while in Kyuubi Mode.
    Both evidenced by these links.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/499/12
    Here he has the tomoe around his neck and he has the horns on his head.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/499/14
    Here, after Naruto locks the four element seal, and the Kyuubi is being locked away he desperately screams that "This is the sage of the six paths"

    In conclusion to that, you guys can discuss the sage's six paths as much as you like, but until you admit that Naruto has what the sage of the six paths had, you are on the wrong track.

    Now to identify what it is that Naruto has, that makes him the sage of the six paths, we have to define what we know about Naruto, which will lead us back to Rikudou Sennin.

    Thanks to Madara spilling secrets while stealing the Rinnengan from Nagato's dead body and from what he told Konan while killing her, we can divine that 2 of the paths are without question...
    1. Uchiha DNA.
    2. Senju DNA.
    These are without argument, two of the pieces necessary for the sage of the six paths.
    They are also two of the keys to being able to use Izangi, the third key being in possession of a sharingan. This we know, because it was also done by Danzo under different cirumstances.

    This Uchiha/Senju combination makes sense when we look at the Rikudou Sennin's sons. One lineage came to be Senju, the other eventually became Uchiha.
    So like I said, these are unquestionably 2 of the 6 paths.
    Moving on,
    Now we have to look for the other 4 paths.
    If we know for a fact that 2 are DNA based, and not based on a doujutsu.
    Its not the Sharingan, Its the UCHIHA DNA. Don't get it twisted.
    Then it stands to reason that its not the Rinnengan, its the Uzumaki DNA.
    "Perhaps Madara's EMS in some way evolved into the Rinnegan he gave to Nagato"
    I believe Danivass has what can be considered closest to the truth.
    This fits in with Madara saying that the Rinnengan was his, but we never saw him with it. It also fits in with the theory that Nagato was the FIRST to have the rinnengan since the Rikudou Sennin. If Madara had them originally, then Nagato wouldnt have been the first. It also makes sense as to why Madara would give up his EMS, he wanted to create the Rinnengan in the world again, and this was the only way. By combining his advanced sharingan with an Uzumaki, the Rinnengan was born into the world again.
    Then he was able to take his eyes back, newly powered up and get with them, his real goal, the Uzumaki DNA that he needed. I will repeat this so all of you understand...
    THE RINNENGAN IS JUST A DOUJUTSU. The DNA that it carries, is Uzumaki, thanks in large part to Nagato. I can make this easier for you to understand by using Kakashi as an example. He has the sharingan, but he is not an uchiha. The eye is just a doujutsu, it by itself is powerful, yes, but only with the correct DNA does it become even more powerful, as evidenced by Itachi, Sasuke, etc. Sasuke with regular eyes, and no sharingan was still a genius. Keep this in mind.
    This leads us to understand that the 3rd path that madara identifies when taking the rinnengan from Nagato is the Uzumaki DNA.
    To prove this to you, I will try once more, so pay attention.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/510/16
    If you look here, Madara is talking to Nagato's dead body and he says.
    "YOU are the third of the six paths" NOT "AH, the rinnengan the third piece of six"
    NOT "finally the rinnengan, i have the third path again!"
    NO NO NO
    he says "YOU are the third path of six."
    and then directly after that in the same dialogue he DROPS THE BOMB.
    "YOU TURNED YOUR UZUMAKI RED HAIR, WHITE!"
    This is where we learned the huge secret that Nagato was an Uzumaki.
    The reason it was explained here is because of the significance of the third path.
    Uzumaki DNA is the third path!
    And so help me god if another one of you argues me on this I'm gonna flame you so hard, you'll think you have explosive diarrhea...

    So now we can all agree wholeheartedly, right?, that
    1. Senju
    2. Uchiha
    3. Uzumaki

    Ok, thats three.
    Three left to go, and here's where it gets tricky...
    We have to assume that Naruto has the other 3. Something that naruto has in him, is the other 3. Lets see what we know about naruto. Naruto is a sage, one of the only sages ever, much like his master Jiraiya. There is something special about being a sage, a sage can posses and use the senjustu chakra. nature chakra. yellow chakra.
    to others, it is deadly and can petrify you if your internal powers arent enough to control it. even jiraiya would start to look like a toad and he trained with it for years.
    This fits in with the name of the Rikudou Sennin. He is the SAGE of the six paths.
    The Rikudou Sennin was a sage, he had nature chakra well under his control.
    He is accredited for being somewhat of a monk, someone at great inner peace.
    We know that Naruto's original training in senjutsu chakra was to obtain a great inner calm and peace of mind/body/spirit. This is another piece of the puzzle.
    We know that the first 3 pieces, uchiha, senju, and uzumaki are all WELL reknowned for their chakra abilities. The uchiha are masters of spirit chakra, the senju are masters of body chakra, and the uzumaki are masters of stamina chakra. (nagato, kushina, naruto) need I say more? So DNA/Chakra/Whatever seems to be the common key between the paths.
    1. Senju
    2. Uchiha
    3. Uzumaki
    4. Senjutsu

    5, I feel very confident in. 6, Im not so sure about...
    What else does Naruto have that the sage would have had?
    What do they have in common? Well, they were both Jinchuurikis right?
    And when did Naruto suddenly appear to have the qualities of the SO6P?
    The minute that he took in the chakra of the Kyuubi! Nothing else changed in that moment. One minute, he didnt have it, the next minute he had the final piece, Tailed Beast Chakra! Senju Chakra, Uchiha Chakra, Uzumaki Chakra, Senjutsu Chakra, AND FOR OUR FIFTH PIECE, TAILED BEAST CHAKRA!! TADA!! Confetti falls from the sky! The skies part and the way becomes clear! LOL.
    Now we have 5. GUARANTEED!

    1. Senju
    2. Uchiha
    3. Uzumaki
    4. Senjutsu
    5. Tailed Beast
    6. ??

    Here's where I'm not so sure...
    Lets keep looking at Naruto, what else does he have, that could be another chakra source, or another type of power?
    We know that Naruto has Wind Element Chakra.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/316/2
    For the longest time, he didnt even know it, maybe he didnt truly have it, as I believe you have to CREATE it with your own chakra. Which is why bloodline limits, and bloodline expansions are so amazing. Because the user is not just using his chakra to create 1 element, he is using his chakra to create, 2 or even 3 elements and then combining them! as evidenced here by Yamato.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/316/6
    By this we can deduce that Naruto has an entirely sperate chakra type from the 5 listed above, he has WIND ELEMENT. Which I believe to be the 6th and final piece of the sage of the six paths! I will list them one more time for you, and the order isn't important, its where they come from and what they represent that is important.

    1. Senju Chakra (I can pretty much guarantee you that Minato was Senju lineage.)
    2. Uchiha Chakra (We know that Itachi gave something to Naruto, and I believe its this, a piece of Uchiha, something he might not be able to get anywhere else)
    3. Senjutsu Chakra (Naruto trained really hard and worked diligently to become a sage, a master of nature chakra)
    4. Uzumaki Chakra (we know for a fact that Naruto's mother was Uzumaki)
    5. Wind Element Chakra (we know that naruto was capable of winde element, but until Kakashi identified it, and helped him learn to manifest and create it, it was not at his disposal)
    6. Tailed Beast Chakra (possibly the rarest form of chakra, not many can claim the title Jinchuuriki)

    So there you have it ladies and germs!
    The Six Paths that Naruto has, that Madara wants.
    I could be wrong, but it feels so right, I will stand by it until proven wrong.
    Feel free to comment, and hate, and even try to disprove me, I'll be happy to hear it.
    Just don't forget who told you!!!

    And one final thing before I go, I had no idea that Naruto was so steeped in Japanese Mythology. Look here for some VERY interesting reading about Susanoo, Izanagi, Tsukiyomi, and Amertasu. It seems Kishi is a man of many minds and talents.
    I'm very impressed.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susanoo
    "In Japanese mythology, Susanoo, the powerful storm of Summer, is the brother of Amaterasu, the goddess of the sun, and of Tsukuyomi, the god of the moon. All three were spawned from Izanagi, when he washed his face clean of the pollutants of Yomi, the underworld. Amaterasu was born when Izanagi washed out his left eye, Tsukuyomi was born from the washing of the right eye, and Susanoo from the washing of the nose."

    Theres also some interesting bits here.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Totsuka-no-Tsurugi
    It seems Orochimaru and the Kusanagi are all inspired from myth as well.

    ENJOY, MATES!!
    good i enjoyed reading this but naruto has senju dna because the uzumaki are blood reatives to senju and they are blood reatives to uchiha thats where his senju dna comes from i think thats just my theory of how he has senju dna
     
         

  4. #224
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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    Thanks Danivass and Floydical for the quick replies.
    I appreciate your comments, both of you.

    Floydical, I wasn't saying that WIND Chakra had to be the requirement.
    I was saying ANY element chakra will fill that path.
    Naruto's just happens to be Wind.

    He worked really hard with Kakashi to develop it.
    Remember Kakashi and Yamato told him that it could take years of training just to be able to turn one's chakra into an element chakra? That is why naruto made all the clones and worked super hard to teach himself how to turn HIS chakra, into WIND chakra. Not to be confused as the same thing. He has to create it from his own. Similar but different from the way he has to pull nature chakra from the outside world, into himself.
    Element chakra is not the same as nature chakra, and neither one is easy to have/get.
    Both are requirement IMO for the 6 paths.

    And I totally agree with what you said about the Rinnengan, it is an integral part of the SO6P, but it is not a requirement to have what Naruto has, and what the Kyuubi identified.

    And I really like your idea of the tailed beasts remembering what the Juubi remembered.
    That is awesome. The Bijuus almost definitely remember being forced out of the SO6P's body when he separated them from the Juubi, but it would even be cooler if the Kyuubi recognized the complex mixing of chakras to create an insane power in Naruto that he could only identify as the only other man to ever possess it, the S06P.
    I would also be willing to believe that as pieces of the Juubi, the Bijuus may very well remember everything that the Juubi ever experienced. Wouldn't that be something?
    Nice ideas, Floyidcal.


    I'm not sure about the SO6P being the SO6P before taming the Juubi.
    My thought is, NO. I think he was the Sage of 5 Paths before taming the Juubi, and then upon defeating the Juubi and saving the world his powers became immense and he became world-reknowned as the SO6P. Thats MY OPINION, nothing more.

    Maybe he did create the Juubi! I Dont know. Interesting thought, I guess Kishi will have to tell us someday where the Juubi really came from. Maybe he was created from the hatred of the collective mankind?! LOL.
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Omnigan
    I'm not sure about the SO6P being the SO6P before taming the Juubi.
    My thought is, NO. I think he was the Sage of 5 Paths before taming the Juubi, and then upon defeating the Juubi and saving the world his powers became immense and he became world-reknowned as the SO6P. Thats MY OPINION, nothing more.
    Omnigan, always nice when someone else sees eye to eye with my feelings and beliefs (see my most previous post)! I have a subtopic related to the six paths that I'd like to discuss...

    First of all, with your knowledge of the manga I won't be referencing much, because I'm sure you'll understand what I am saying. Now going by what the narutowikia says and what the anime has shown us the 9-tails seems to be capable of using wind and fire chakra, http://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Nine-Tailed_Demon_Fox (reading under abilities describes as much). We know that when Naruto turns into the nine-tails form he is using the 9-tails chakra. I expect another layer to Naruto using such a form is an enhancement to his wind chakra and being able to use fire chakra. This is a deadly combination, since wind breathes more life into fire! Thoughts on this, if you'd like to provide them of course!

    We do differ a bit when it does come to the elemental chakra path. All of you stated is very well put, true, and makes sense, but you don't think all five elements:wind, water, fire and ying and yang (being one in the same) need to be mastered before that path is complete? It wouldn't be too far-fetched for Naruto to master all of these, because one Rinnegan is still floating around, granted it's in Tobi-Madara's possession. Just curious to see why and even if you believe only one elemental charka is needed to fulfill that path...

    Farewell fellow nin!

    Quote Originally Posted by danviass
    Thanks for your reply, Pervy nin, now to the point.

    How did the sage know he needed to master those paths (whatever they were)? I mean, the Juubi cannot have possibly been present on the ninja world for a long time - it would have probably made a hole through the core of the planet. At least if I were a big bad ten tailed beast with a seemingly infinite chakra source I would have. It is a mystery how the Juubi came to be on the ninja world, but for the reasons above I can say it either appeared once when the sage sealed it or many times over a long period of time but after some rampage it disappeared again. Okay, maybe the sage knew in another way, I won't argue with that one, I just want to see your thoughts about this

    I am a man who does not like to assume things for sure until they are proven to be such. I accept theories that cannot be firmly proved but I always keep in mind that they could not be quite right. About the senjutsu chakra mastery, I am split in two - I really see it as a possible path, as it would be an important step in self-balance. But I cannot imagine the So6P taking his time to gather natural energy while the Juubi rampages nearby. But, as I have no proof I do not assume any of these two possibilities to be true. Hell, maybe the sage had the self-control to gather up senjutsu chakra and then used it to improve his speed, the power of his techniques etc.

    Uzumaki chakra/sealing techs both being one path is possible. Let me just add - Kushina did not only survive for some time after the Nine-tails was released from her, no, she had just given birth. Imagine how weak she was even before Madara took the fox out of her. The strength of her chakra is more than capable of enduring the Nine-tails' removal. So it seems it is the only appropriate to be used in a sealing process - but I guess sealing techs depend on the person's "affinity" for them. Maybe strong chakra is what grants that "affinity" (for the lack of a better word in my mind to describe this) to sealing techs. So these two are interconnected and cannot really be separated. Just speculating here, not really saying anything different from what you said.
    danivass, thanks for not missing my post and replying to it! Now to elaborate on your beliefs...

    Either the So6P was a master of five before the Juubi came to be, or he knew he needed to master five paths to combat a demon that would randomly appear, much like the current tailed beast do when they're free. I believe both options are satisfactory choices.

    I can totally understand you being a skeptic, I am much the same. I still can't believe 100% that Tobi is indeed Madara lol. Like Omnigan said earlier of So6P being referred to as a SAGE, a term used only on two humans (that we know of) and the sage frogs. In addition, he was described as a peaceful being (monk like), so being in tune with the nature around him would make sense for him. I won't repeat how much of an enhancement sage mode is and how I believe it enhanced all of the So6P's during his fight with the juubi. Perhaps the answer lies with the great toad sage on Mount Myoboku. We know how sketchy his memory is lol. He could have very well trained the So6P to use senjutsu and simply forgot as time went by. Kishi will provide the answer soon, I just hope with such large revelations, that it doesn't spell the end of the manga!

    To keep it simple and clean, i believe the sealing knowledge and uzumaki chakra are one in the same and equally important for that path. Much like uchiha chakra and sharingan eyes.

    I believe the biggest question that has yet to be answered, is...How Sasuke will tie into this!? With this discussion it implies that an epic showdown between two beings reminiscent of So6P (Naruto and Tobi-Madara). But I know Kishi will make Sasuke's role much larger in all of this, but what will this role be???
     
         
    Last edited by Pervy nin; 01-30-2011 at 10:35 PM.

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Omningan View Post
    Thanks Danivass and Floydical for the quick replies.
    I appreciate your comments, both of you.

    Floydical, I wasn't saying that WIND Chakra had to be the requirement.
    I was saying ANY element chakra will fill that path.
    Naruto's just happens to be Wind.

    He worked really hard with Kakashi to develop it.
    Remember Kakashi and Yamato told him that it could take years of training just to be able to turn one's chakra into an element chakra? That is why naruto made all the clones and worked super hard to teach himself how to turn HIS chakra, into WIND chakra. Not to be confused as the same thing. He has to create it from his own. Similar but different from the way he has to pull nature chakra from the outside world, into himself.
    Element chakra is not the same as nature chakra, and neither one is easy to have/get.
    Both are requirement IMO for the 6 paths.

    And I totally agree with what you said about the Rinnengan, it is an integral part of the SO6P, but it is not a requirement to have what Naruto has, and what the Kyuubi identified.

    And I really like your idea of the tailed beasts remembering what the Juubi remembered.
    That is awesome. The Bijuus almost definitely remember being forced out of the SO6P's body when he separated them from the Juubi, but it would even be cooler if the Kyuubi recognized the complex mixing of chakras to create an insane power in Naruto that he could only identify as the only other man to ever possess it, the S06P.
    I would also be willing to believe that as pieces of the Juubi, the Bijuus may very well remember everything that the Juubi ever experienced. Wouldn't that be something?
    Nice ideas, Floyidcal.


    I'm not sure about the SO6P being the SO6P before taming the Juubi.
    My thought is, NO. I think he was the Sage of 5 Paths before taming the Juubi, and then upon defeating the Juubi and saving the world his powers became immense and he became world-reknowned as the SO6P. Thats MY OPINION, nothing more.

    Maybe he did create the Juubi! I Dont know. Interesting thought, I guess Kishi will have to tell us someday where the Juubi really came from. Maybe he was created from the hatred of the collective mankind?! LOL.
    Thanks bro, ya I get most of my ideas simply by reading posts like yours and reacting to what I read. As for the Element chakra, that makes sense. Your right, it was not easy for Naruto to master wind and it has been said to be a very uncommon affinity. Indeed, a mastery of an affinity based element seems very plausible for a path.

    In regard to the Kyuubi's memories, since the first time we ever heard about the Juubi was from Madara before the war, I am leaning toward the idea that the individual 9 bijus only have memories after having been separated. But whether that is true or, if in fact, they have the full memories of the Juubi it is still very logical for the Kyuubi to remember the sage.

    Okay now for the point I wanted to discuss: "The Kyuubi remembering the complex mixing of chakras mimicking those of the So6P". This is a very good statement you made about how the Kyuubi identified Naruto. Lets look back at the chapter again:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/499/12
    This page and the next two are the basis of this fact. If we look closely, the Kyuubi doesn't actually identify Naruto as being similar to the sage until page 14:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/499/14
    He only identifies him as such once Naruto uses that advanced suppression technique on him. I want to call this technique Kido but I don't think we have a proper name for it. Basically, I am saying that just seeing Naruto looking the way he did did not actually identify him as the So6P to the Kyuubi. It seems that it was his suppression technique that the Kyuubi remembered. What does that say about his memories? Well I doubt the Sage specifically suppressed each and every Biju like that after having separated them. Perhaps the Kyuubi does have the Juubi's memories and remembers being suppressed by the sage in the Juubi's form. We know that the sage passed his sealing techniques on to the rest of the world and thats why they could seal the bijus, but it seems to me that after he separated them, they ran free for a while until the first hokage started taming them and dispersing them around the Lands.

    Bottom line? It seems that that technique was a key power that the Sage possessed. Since Naruto was seen 'locking' his seal before the technique was used, we can consider it an advanced seal. One question is how did naruto know that doing that would suppress the Kyuubi so well? I guess that it was one of the things Bee told him to do before fighting the Kyuubi and since Naruto had just taken his chakra, maybe he knew it was the right time to make the new seal. Either way, that seal seems to be what the Kyuubi remembered the most in regard to the So6P but the way he looked was also very similar, no doubt.
     
         
    Last edited by Floydical; 01-30-2011 at 11:00 PM.

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    this chapter was aiight
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    do anyone have an idea on wht sasuke eyes would look like
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by rinnsharingan View Post
    do anyone have an idea on wht sasuke eyes would look like
    We know it should be a combination of his and Itachi's shape pattern. My guess would be one of these two:

    1. Similar to his combined-ellipse pattern but with sharp curved edges like Itachi's had

    or how bout this:

    2. Identical to Itachi's but red where it was black and black where it was red, like how Sasuke's is now.

    My original thought was that it would simply be itachi's old pattern on top of Sasuke's old pattern (just like Madara's EMS) but I don't think it will be that simple since they had backward red/black patterns and wouldn't combine well when superimposed one over the other.

    Anythings possible though .
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    I agree, I don't think it was how Naruto looked that the Kyuubi saw as the SO6P. WE saw that. It was a way for us of linking the way Naruto looks in that mode, to the images we've seen of the SO6P whenever he is mentioned. He always has those 6 tomoe around his neck, and seems to have some sort of horns. (hair or a hairpiece idk) That is part of the clue that Naruto is a new SO6P. He visually looks like him, or shares some qualities at the very least.
    The second part of this is that the Kyuubi recognized that sealing/chakra/power that Naruto used to lock the Kyuubi away. It is a four element seal, Kushina tells us that. How Naruto knew it and how to use it? I have no clue. Maybe he isn't as clueless as we all think. I don't know if that seal is what is unique or if it's the chakra/power behind it that is unique, but something about it made the Kyuubi feel the presence of the Sage of the Six Paths.
    Much like when Sasuke encounters the Kyuubi inside Naruto. The Kyuubi says that Sasuke's power/chakra reminds him of Madara's. Somehow, what Naruto did or had in that moment, reminded the Kyuubi of the SO6P. That is the second part of us understanding Naruto as a new SO6P. The final part, is that we know some of the paths required to become like the SO6P. Madara told them to us, and we know for a fact that some of them Naruto qualifies for. Which led me into the question of what the other are. Obviously I have explained all that in great length. I appreciate all of you who have taken the time to read it and respond with your thoughts or ideas. Thank you. I look forward to anymore that come.

    Pervy-nin! Thanks for the post man!
    I'm not sure about the kyuubi giving Naruto the Fire element.
    Here is why i think that: I believe that the Kyuubi molds his own chakra into fire.
    Naruto does not know how to do this, as far as we know he might not even be able to, ever. I'm not sure we will even see much Element/Sage Chakra from Naruto. Realize that now he has access to the Kyuubi's chakra. It is SUPER powerful. He is going to create a Rasengan out of THAT chakra. That beats the hell out of a Wind Rasengan or a Sage Rasengan any day of the week that ends with Y. In effect, a tailed beast bomb in the palm of his hands. I believe, and will predict that Naruto could even nearly pierce a Susanoo with it. Which we know to be nearly impenetrable. The tailed beast bomb delivered via Naruto's Rasengan is going to be absolutely devastating, and I eagerly await its release. It is a technique that is nasty with regular chakra, even nastier if enhanced with sage chakra, and super nasty enchanced with Wind Element. Imagine how destructive it will be if created from the Kyuubi's chakra. It could kill anyone instantly on impact. Nice question about Kyuubi's Chakra Elements, though.
    I hope my response helped.
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    how atrong do u guys think the gin and kin brothers are
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    do u guys think sasuke has power of the rikodou sage
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    i think uchiha is much stronger than senju and so far i think the sharingan is stronger than the rinnegan but do anyone know what the final secret to the ems was
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by rinnsharingan View Post
    i think uchiha is much stronger than senju and so far i think the sharingan is stronger than the rinnegan but do anyone know what the final secret to the ems was
    First off, stop posting in succession like that. You should have just combined all those questions into one post. Beyond that, you posted a good question there. Lets look at what Itachi told us here:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/386/9
    The 'final' secret of the Mangekyou is that if a person with a dieing MS implants another persons' sharingan, it will become EMS. It implies in this page that only clansmen can do this successfully, which implies SIBLINGS, not just a fellow uchiha. Notice how Madara explained in 510 that Uchiha would "kill their best friends to get MS and kill their brothers to get EMS"? This is the final secret that Itachi told us about.......

    However, he also states that it unlocked a completely new doujutsu that we have yet to see a confirmed explanation of. Maybe that mysterious Doujutsu is Rinnegan? Sound possible? that would mean that EMS essentially equals Rinnegan? Eh I actually doubt that but we don't know for sure what this doujutsu is that is being referred to here. Is that the 'final secret' your referring to?
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Floydical View Post
    First off, stop posting in succession like that. You should have just combined all those questions into one post. Beyond that, you posted a good question there. Lets look at what Itachi told us here:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/386/9
    The 'final' secret of the Mangekyou is that if a person with a dieing MS implants another persons' sharingan, it will become EMS. It implies in this page that only clansmen can do this successfully, which implies SIBLINGS, not just a fellow uchiha. Notice how Madara explained in 510 that Uchiha would "kill their best friends to get MS and kill their brothers to get EMS"? This is the final secret that Itachi told us about.......

    However, he also states that it unlocked a completely new doujutsu that we have yet to see a confirmed explanation of. Maybe that mysterious Doujutsu is Rinnegan? Sound possible? that would mean that EMS essentially equals Rinnegan? Eh I actually doubt that but we don't know for sure what this doujutsu is that is being referred to here. Is that the 'final secret' your referring to?
    i am just going off of the final secret that itachi mentioned
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/386/13
    here it states that members of the uchiha clan would kill their best friend for the ms and then their siblings to make it permanent. now if other people did have ms and take a siblings eyes, they would gain ems. however, we know that nobody other than madara, and now sasuke, gained an ems. the final requirement may be that the siblings eyes need to willingly be given up in order for the ems to be unlocked. if this were true, then madara would have been telling the truth when he told sasuke that his brother offered his eyes to him.
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/399/4
    now itachi willingly gave up his eyes and ms abilities to sasuke right before dieing. this could be the final secret to ems: the eyes of the sibling must be given up willingly.

    this is just one idea, everyone feel free to give thoughts supporting or rejecting it. I'm always open to hearing different theories.
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    can madara use susanoo amerterasu and tsyukomi its odd he havent used them yet not even against the 4th hokage and if he had them he wouldnt be scared of itachi anyone agree or disagree
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by rinnsharingan View Post
    can madara use susanoo amerterasu and tsyukomi its odd he havent used them yet not even against the 4th hokage and if he had them he wouldnt be scared of itachi anyone agree or disagree
    We don't yet know what Madara's MS abilities are. He did refer to Sasuke as having a good pair of eyes being able to use Susanoo so we have to assume he knows something that we don't about MS abilities. Maybe he has seen someone before who could use those 3 abilities (himself, his brother or someone else from the past maybe?) or he knows how rare certain MS abilities are. I have had discussions about this topic in the past, but the way I see it, a true Uchiha with two sharingans will spawn 3 MS abilities and those 3 abilities are generated from a limited number of possible MS abilities that are determined perhaps radomly or based on the person's affinity/ power. Sound plausible? Feel free to retort instead of just moving on to new topics each time .
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    MEi do u think she is fighting hanzo
    or is she somewhere else



    A has so much respoinsbilty as the leader of the army
    but i can assum tobi will transport there and fight the 5th and A

    Choujiro courl be with mei also


    i have a random theory
    concering saskue jugo and suiegets u
    k imagine saskue
    wearing Madras old battle armour and such 3rd in command or 4th in command
    TObi as its in his power finds Jugo and suiegutsu
    Saskue and tobi combine there powers and gives both of these guyz special power ups

    and as saskue makes tobis forces stronger and leads 1k zetsus along with his overpowerd duo

    narutos istraining and most like masterd FTG
    Rasegnan
    TBR
    and also made and encahcned version of the cloak with sage mode





    Kabuto
    he will cotinue to surpries us all
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Floydical View Post
    We don't yet know what Madara's MS abilities are. He did refer to Sasuke as having a good pair of eyes being able to use Susanoo so we have to assume he knows something that we don't about MS abilities. Maybe he has seen someone before who could use those 3 abilities (himself, his brother or someone else from the past maybe?) or he knows how rare certain MS abilities are. I have had discussions about this topic in the past, but the way I see it, a true Uchiha with two sharingans will spawn 3 MS abilities and those 3 abilities are generated from a limited number of possible MS abilities that are determined perhaps radomly or based on the person's affinity/ power. Sound plausible? Feel free to retort instead of just moving on to new topics each time .
    because of MS
    SASkue can utulize blaze Realse
    so i think there are more the one MS techniques
    based on japanese Mythology
     
         

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    Re: Naruto Manga Chapter 525 Discussion and 526 Predictions

    my bad for all the different topics its my first time using this and i have so much questions. since kakashi got his qwn type of ms maybe its possible that different experiences cause different ms to be awakened and kamui looks just like madaras space time maybe its an advanced version of kamui
     
         

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