View Poll Results: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

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  • Kishi forgot about her

    7 10.00%
  • She was meant to be that way

    39 55.71%
  • Their is still time.....

    24 34.29%
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  1. #51
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by kefka1214 View Post
    Screw Sakura. we want HINATA
    yeah dude... where is hinata???? we want her not the lousy sakura-chan... :P
     
         

  2. #52
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by SageoftheSixpath View Post


    yeah dude... where is hinata???? we want her not the lousy sakura-chan... :P
    agree O.O
     
         

  3. #53
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by siyo View Post
    She is so worthless she made Sasori look an amateur, the guy who took out the kazekage with iron sand, by himself. It’s like her characters development stopped after that fight and Kishi just gave up on her or worse simply forgot.
    So true, she hasn't developed a bit since that fight. We haven't seen a single new thing of interest. We barely see Neji and Hinata in battle yet we've seen a few new things from them...Air Palm Wall, Twin Lions Fists, Gentle Fist Body Blow (I don't remember the exact name). Just a shame.
     
         

  4. #54
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    true thoh
     
         

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    true say
     
         

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    nice true say
     
         

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    i agree that sakura is worthless but i like to be optimistic about her development
     
         

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Sakura is a huge disappointment when I first saw her in that batle against sasori I thought she was awsome and can only get better then after anout 300 or so chapters we see no improvment she is weak and I say she should be dead I wish that fake neji had killed her but alweel I doubt naruto will marry hinata as much as I want it to happen naruto is gonna end up with sakura wicth is bs naruto should be with hinata
     
         

  9. #59
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    She will step up to her game again. Wait and see. ^^

    And yes, she is annoying sometimes. Definetly. But so is Sasuke and Naruto. But they are different personalities and the fact is no one likes everybody.
    I still like them all with their flaws and all
     
         

  10. #60
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by yahiko24 View Post
    nice true say
    Please edit your post to collapse 3->1, as what you're doing is considered spamming, and you can get infracted for it.

    Clans & Bloodlines
    One thing people haven't been mentioning much about Tsunade vs. Sakura is that Tsunade is the granddaughter of Hashirama and has both Senju and Uzumaki blood and raising. Granted, it didn't do much for her brother Iwaki, lol. Sakura doesn't have that. Naruto has Uzumaki and Namikaze (for whatever it's possibly worth) and Sasuke is a true heir to the Uchiha. Thus, her disparity isn't just about being female it's about not being from a famous clan I think. I'm not Kishi though.

    Sakura's Legacy
    Regarding Sakura, she may surpass Tsunade in one area and may well become the greatest medic of all time unless she is surpassed by a future generation I expect, but unless she dedicates herself to something else she'll never become a complete shinobi like Tsunade. Right now, she has the war as a medic and must capitalize on it to master her understanding of medical ninjutsu, healing, and the creation and antidotes of poisons.

    While the war is raging I don't think she has time to learn genjutsu, summon Katsuyu (especially since Tsunade always has her summoned for communication.), etc.

    Sakura stopped developing
    What Sakura hasn't done that Naruto and Sasuke have is train and improve themselves on their own, even if training with others. Naruto had help with sage mode, but there was a great deal he had to overcome himself including his secret training, the same goes for Sasuke. Even Tsunade during her time away from Konoha trained to generate her yin blue diamond seal and release for mitotic regeneration. This is the area that Sakura or her character did not develop. She didn't learn summonings, Tsunade's electrical muscle confusion (whatever it's called) jutsu, Shizune'z poison cloud, genjutsu with Kakashi. Again, this is where she failed, she stopped developing, Kishi I suppose felt content that she was where he wanted her, I don't know.

    Given that the story might end shortly after the war, I don't know how much further she'll progress.

    Peace
     
         

  11. #61
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by isthatnecessary View Post
    That's a superfecial similarity and yes it was inteded. But the backgrounds are different and so are the characters and their reasonings. There is a hell lot of difference between Oro and Sasuke and between Tsunade and Sakura.
    Tsunade had a strong background, Sakura doesn't. When Tsunade lost it she lost big time, Sakura is trying to make herself useful. Not undermining Tsunade but, pointing out the difference in background stories and personalities. Both do have strong commitments though and medical skills..
    I wouldn't call the resembles between the sannin and team 7 superficiel. Of course they are not clones but they are taking some of the same paths, and they have already been through some of the same struggles. Jiraiya spend the majority of his life chasing orochimaro, and we see the same today.Naruto is trying to erase the darkness in sasuke, maybe with a different result.Through training they have automatically gained some of the same habits, abilties, and mindsets.

    Quote Originally Posted by isthatnecessary View Post
    People comment more on the size Tsunade's breast than her fighting skills. Nb memebers here comment Sakuras skills are in bedromm and you are accusing me of lowering expectations? I gave you a realistic picture...
    Big difference, the people you are talking about are not kishi.You made a bold statement regarding kishi's view of women, and i am pretty sure that is an assumption..

    I gave you list of powerful women and some i based on status in the manga(hokage/jounins) and some on the big improvements we have seen(like hinato who have perhaps grown the most).
    Another thing is most of the people in naruto are filler characters e.g kiba,shino, and choji, so i don't think the women are any different but nonetheless a kage is the most powerful person in a village(and two of them women).It just happens to be that the main character is a boy and sakura is on his team so she should get time to shine, like sasuke, unfortunately i believe kishi made her irrelevant.

    Quote Originally Posted by isthatnecessary View Post
    Sakura's training started to suffer since Sasuke got the curse mark. During chunin exams Kakashi paid his whole attention to Sasuke. Naruto found out Jiraiya after dumping Ebisu(??I don't remeber the name), Sakura had no one for a while. Kakashi may have said that Sakura was genjutsu type but he never seemed to teach her any. She herself sought Tsunade finally and learnt medical skills. Tsunade has Hokage duties to perform as well......
    This is your best point.Kakashi did neglect sakura for sasuke and he did not teach her any genjutsu, but it was only a little while before the chunnin exams.However, there was a big time skip where she could have trained with other genjutsu users,and get more out of her training with the fifht hokage. And after the timeskip she started out with great momentum but it was quicky stopped with lack of improvements.And i don't mean medically.....

    Quote Originally Posted by naruto_14 View Post
    yeah mybad i went over board with that. i assumed it was one of those who hates sakura threads hope were cool now. +Rep for ya man but to answer your question i feel kishi gives each one of side characters each a moment in the manga thats all about them not naruto. sakura's moment just ended a long time ago.
    we're cool



    Quote Originally Posted by govind madhu View Post
    skaura was first created as a sideline character with no importance anyway kishi meant it that way...but the people got the wrong idea and took her as the heroine of the show/manga so he just didn't have the mind to break their hearts.......viola...answered
    lol, is this a brilliant analysis or was there a story behind it? like the sasuke one...


    Quote Originally Posted by BigTDogg220 View Post
    So true, she hasn't developed a bit since that fight. We haven't seen a single new thing of interest. We barely see Neji and Hinata in battle yet we've seen a few new things from them...Air Palm Wall, Twin Lions Fists, Gentle Fist Body Blow (I don't remember the exact name). Just a shame.
    yea, she stopped evolving while others kept going.
     
         
    Last edited by siyo; 06-21-2011 at 04:10 PM.

  12. #62
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by leafeater View Post
    Please edit your post to collapse 3->1, as what you're doing is considered spamming, and you can get infracted for it.

    Clans & Bloodlines
    One thing people haven't been mentioning much about Tsunade vs. Sakura is that Tsunade is the granddaughter of Hashirama and has both Senju and Uzumaki blood and raising. Granted, it didn't do much for her brother Iwaki, lol. Sakura doesn't have that. Naruto has Uzumaki and Namikaze (for whatever it's possibly worth) and Sasuke is a true heir to the Uchiha. Thus, her disparity isn't just about being female it's about not being from a famous clan I think. I'm not Kishi though.

    Sakura's Legacy
    Regarding Sakura, she may surpass Tsunade in one area and may well become the greatest medic of all time unless she is surpassed by a future generation I expect, but unless she dedicates herself to something else she'll never become a complete shinobi like Tsunade. Right now, she has the war as a medic and must capitalize on it to master her understanding of medical ninjutsu, healing, and the creation and antidotes of poisons.

    While the war is raging I don't think she has time to learn genjutsu, summon Katsuyu (especially since Tsunade always has her summoned for communication.), etc.

    Sakura stopped developing
    What Sakura hasn't done that Naruto and Sasuke have is train and improve themselves on their own, even if training with others. Naruto had help with sage mode, but there was a great deal he had to overcome himself including his secret training, the same goes for Sasuke. Even Tsunade during her time away from Konoha trained to generate her yin blue diamond seal and release for mitotic regeneration. This is the area that Sakura or her character did not develop. She didn't learn summonings, Tsunade's electrical muscle confusion (whatever it's called) jutsu, Shizune'z poison cloud, genjutsu with Kakashi. Again, this is where she failed, she stopped developing, Kishi I suppose felt content that she was where he wanted her, I don't know.

    Given that the story might end shortly after the war, I don't know how much further she'll progress.

    Peace
    i feel kishi gives each one of side characters each a fight in the manga thats all about them not naruto. sakura's moment just ended a long time ago. besides she is the same level as the other konoha charactars in her age group well accept for sai.
     
         

  13. #63
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by leafeater View Post

    Clans & Bloodlines
    One thing people haven't been mentioning much about Tsunade vs. Sakura is that Tsunade is the granddaughter of Hashirama and has both Senju and Uzumaki blood and raising. Granted, it didn't do much for her brother Iwaki, lol. Sakura doesn't have that. Naruto has Uzumaki and Namikaze (for whatever it's possibly worth) and Sasuke is a true heir to the Uchiha. Thus, her disparity isn't just about being female it's about not being from a famous clan I think. I'm not Kishi though.

    Sakura's Legacy
    Regarding Sakura, she may surpass Tsunade in one area and may well become the greatest medic of all time unless she is surpassed by a future generation I expect, but unless she dedicates herself to something else she'll never become a complete shinobi like Tsunade. Right now, she has the war as a medic and must capitalize on it to master her understanding of medical ninjutsu, healing, and the creation and antidotes of poisons.

    While the war is raging I don't think she has time to learn genjutsu, summon Katsuyu (especially since Tsunade always has her summoned for communication.), etc.

    Sakura stopped developing
    What Sakura hasn't done that Naruto and Sasuke have is train and improve themselves on their own, even if training with others. Naruto had help with sage mode, but there was a great deal he had to overcome himself including his secret training, the same goes for Sasuke. Even Tsunade during her time away from Konoha trained to generate her yin blue diamond seal and release for mitotic regeneration. This is the area that Sakura or her character did not develop. She didn't learn summonings, Tsunade's electrical muscle confusion (whatever it's called) jutsu, Shizune'z poison cloud, genjutsu with Kakashi. Again, this is where she failed, she stopped developing, Kishi I suppose felt content that she was where he wanted her, I don't know.

    Given that the story might end shortly after the war, I don't know how much further she'll progress.

    Peace

    good post, exactly my sentiments.I was just about to say that it appears she didn't even make contract with the slugs, and she(kishi) decided to focus all her attention on the medical side of things.And if we are talking about healing she could surpass the tsunade(not as a comlete shinibo), but i think most people expected more. We got tons of hints about her potentiel ,but it is beginning to look fruitless, and as you sais, the training is/was key.Anything is possible and she could rededicate herself, but yes look like the ship has sailed.
    The clan thing is a plausible option, even though we have seen strong people without senju and uchiha blood lol.
     
         
    Last edited by siyo; 06-20-2011 at 10:00 PM.

  14. #64
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Sakura's problem is she hasn't found as new man like Tsunade did with Dan, it's time to move on. Get on the rebound, become obsessed over some other cute guy in Konoha.
     
         

  15. #65
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by leafeater View Post
    Please edit your post to collapse 3->1, as what you're doing is considered spamming, and you can get infracted for it.

    Clans & Bloodlines
    One thing people haven't been mentioning much about Tsunade vs. Sakura is that Tsunade is the granddaughter of Hashirama and has both Senju and Uzumaki blood and raising. Granted, it didn't do much for her brother Iwaki, lol. Sakura doesn't have that. Naruto has Uzumaki and Namikaze (for whatever it's possibly worth) and Sasuke is a true heir to the Uchiha. Thus, her disparity isn't just about being female it's about not being from a famous clan I think. I'm not Kishi though.

    Sakura's Legacy
    Regarding Sakura, she may surpass Tsunade in one area and may well become the greatest medic of all time unless she is surpassed by a future generation I expect, but unless she dedicates herself to something else she'll never become a complete shinobi like Tsunade. Right now, she has the war as a medic and must capitalize on it to master her understanding of medical ninjutsu, healing, and the creation and antidotes of poisons.

    While the war is raging I don't think she has time to learn genjutsu, summon Katsuyu (especially since Tsunade always has her summoned for communication.), etc.

    Sakura stopped developing
    What Sakura hasn't done that Naruto and Sasuke have is train and improve themselves on their own, even if training with others. Naruto had help with sage mode, but there was a great deal he had to overcome himself including his secret training, the same goes for Sasuke. Even Tsunade during her time away from Konoha trained to generate her yin blue diamond seal and release for mitotic regeneration. This is the area that Sakura or her character did not develop. She didn't learn summonings, Tsunade's electrical muscle confusion (whatever it's called) jutsu, Shizune'z poison cloud, genjutsu with Kakashi. Again, this is where she failed, she stopped developing, Kishi I suppose felt content that she was where he wanted her, I don't know.

    Given that the story might end shortly after the war, I don't know how much further she'll progress.

    Peace
    I agree with the latter part of your post, I think the stuff about the bloodlines and lineage are just not the her problem in anyway.


    People forget how she was at the start of the series. SHe really was despistable person to be with if your on ninja mission that could mean life or death out there. Kishi has displayed a certain type of person purpose their is no mistake here on kishi part.

    Her shortcomings come from a more simple problem and that is muturity.

    The key problem sakura has is a motivational one. She's not in the right state of mind to be a affective shinobi. Having things going for like bloodline limits or a farmous bloodline are all good and all but the growth comes from the person's motivations.

    In alot of ways she is far more naive than naruto, naruto is labelled as naive about is his idealogy BUT isn't naive on the battlefield. He knows what he has to do when it comes to fight time and just does it. Same with sasuke he has strong convictions in his actions he does what he wants and does it. Sakura simply put lacks the know how regarding the battlefield.

    And ask yourselves why is it always like this for sakura and the answer comes from the start of the series. THats right, the very beginning.

    Compare her idea of what a shinobi is to naruto and sasuke at the start of the series. Naruto and sasuke wanted to learn techniques and just simply WANT TO BECOME better. Particlular naruto just wanted to be a shinobi, Sasuke had slightly different reasons to get stronger because of itachi. But Sakura didn't want to learn new techniques or think about getting stronger. Its like she become a shinobi but didn't think the baggage of protecting your village and getting stronger came along with it. If something like this happened in reality the best describtion you would give it unprofessional.

    And once she did decide to go to tsunade to actually make something for her life, it was actually only to do with sasuke not about protecting the village. And this was eveident in the last meeting she had with sasuke.

    Although I think her recent meeting with sasuke has pointed out her shortcommings, she admitts it and whats to work hard now not just for sasuke but for the village to help protect naruto in this war. Thats frist step in solving a problem. She will get better but it maybe too late for her to be effective now when her village needs her the most.

    Nice and short, reason for sakura's shortcomings come down to her lack marturity early on in her life. It stunned her growth as a shinobi.
     
         

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    All I gotta say is that she had two chances to kill the hell out of Sasuke, screw the poison kunai, she should have just smashed him with her fists, especially the second time, he couldn't do susano'o anymore, perfect time for a beat down but nope.
     
         

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Well i guess with japanese dudes or culture the women cannot be stronger than men and women have to have some vulnerability just like we see in hinata and even tsunade. On the other hand i think we are seeing kishi developing sakura because we know she can fight but i think she finally got the message that sasuke dont give a s*** and was about to kill her so i think during or after the war we will see a stronger sakura one more determined and focused but i guess he had to show all the crying and her unable to kill sasuke to show her development. Dont dish kishi just yet. Lets wait a few more manga.
     
         

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by psukkar View Post
    I agree with the latter part of your post, I think the stuff about the bloodlines and lineage are just not the her problem in anyway.


    In alot of ways she is far more naive than naruto, naruto is labelled as naive about is his idealogy BUT isn't naive on the battlefield. He knows what he has to do when it comes to fight time and just does it. Same with sasuke he has strong convictions in his actions he does what he wants and does it. Sakura simply put lacks the know how regarding the battlefield.

    And ask yourselves why is it always like this for sakura and the answer comes from the start of the series. THats right, the very beginning.

    Compare her idea of what a shinobi is to naruto and sasuke at the start of the series. Naruto and sasuke wanted to learn techniques and just simply WANT TO BECOME better. Particlular naruto just wanted to be a shinobi, Sasuke had slightly different reasons to get stronger because of itachi. But Sakura didn't want to learn new techniques or think about getting stronger. Its like she become a shinobi but didn't think the baggage of protecting your village and getting stronger came along with it. If something like this happened in reality the best describtion you would give it unprofessional.

    And once she did decide to go to tsunade to actually make something for her life, it was actually only to do with sasuke not about protecting the village. And this was eveident in the last meeting she had with sasuke.

    Although I think her recent meeting with sasuke has pointed out her shortcommings, she admitts it and whats to work hard now not just for sasuke but for the village to help protect naruto in this war. Thats frist step in solving a problem. She will get better but it maybe too late for her to be effective now when her village needs her the most.

    Nice and short, reason for sakura's shortcomings come down to her lack marturity early on in her life. It stunned her growth as a shinobi.
    nice post also, but you are pointing it out yourself. Motivation used to be a problem but that changed with sasuke,supposedly she matured.She took intiative herself by training with the fifht hokage, so she must have had determination.So at that time you would think she would have trained and giving it her all, so she could keep up with sasuke(even if she coudln't kill him).
     
         

  19. #69
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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Sakura stopped developing
    What Sakura hasn't done that Naruto and Sasuke have is train and improve themselves on their own, even if training with others. Naruto had help with sage mode, but there was a great deal he had to overcome himself including his secret training, the same goes for Sasuke. Even Tsunade during her time away from Konoha trained to generate her yin blue diamond seal and release for mitotic regeneration. This is the area that Sakura or her character did not develop. She didn't learn summonings, Tsunade's electrical muscle confusion (whatever it's called) jutsu, Shizune'z poison cloud, genjutsu with Kakashi. Again, this is where she failed, she stopped developing, Kishi I suppose felt content that she was where he wanted her, I don't know.

    Given that the story might end shortly after the war, I don't know how much further she'll progress

    You are right When you put it that way. But we should also consider that nobnody has Naruto's stamina to be honest. Sasuke again is an exception. Sakura ended up in a team of highly gifted people.

    Sakura, Tenten, Rock Lee can reach a certain hight but that's it for them without special bloodlines.

    Kishi really ignored her, Siyo called it a bold statement but, I stand by it- No female character is paid as much attention as the male characters in the series. They are in the supporting role or filler characters. Tsunade got the most footage but with Raikage in recent chapters she was acting quite submissive for too long.

    We do not know a single Uchiha female warrior even though we can guess sasuke's mother was also a shinobi. Where are nara women? Hinata was sent to be a shinobi because Hiyashi was disapointed if I remember correctly. Hinabi is safe at home even if Hiyashi teaches her.

    Kushina- do we know her rank yet? or about her fighting skills other than jinchuriki abilities? We know she was kidnapped by Kumo and saved by Minato- all we saw an image of Kushina being carried in Minato's arm.

    OP counted the Mizukage and other random strong shinbies but they are just there. No story behind them.


    Quote Originally Posted by psukkar View Post
    Nice and short, reason for sakura's shortcomings come down to her lack marturity early on in her life. It stunned her growth as a shinobi.

    None of the girls were shown with mush motivation were they? all of them pining for Sasuke.. She was a good student but, I agree she had not motivation like Naruto or Sasuke. Who in the village had a motivation like that? Maybe HInata and Rock Lee to some extent... Could they keep up?

    I am not disagreeing with either of you. and when looking at your POV that's also somewhat true but I guess you are missing the other side.
     
         
    Last edited by Ira; 06-21-2011 at 02:29 AM.

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by isthatnecessary View Post
    You are right When you put it that way. But we should also consider that nobnody has Naruto's stamina to be honest. Sasuke again is an exception. Sakura ended up in a team of highly gifted people.

    Sakura, Tenten, Rock Lee can reach a certain hight but that's it for them without special bloodlines.

    Kishi really ignored her, Siyo called it a bold statement but, I stand by it- No female character is paid as much attention as the male characters in the series. They are in the supporting role or filler characters. Tsunade got the most footage but with Raikage in recent chapters she was acting quite submissive for too long.

    We do not know a single Uchiha female warrior even though we can guess sasuke's mother was also a shinobi. Where are nara women? Hinata was sent to be a shinobi because Hiyashi was disapointed if I remember correctly. Hinabi is safe at home even if Hiyashi teaches her.

    Kushina- do we know her rank yet? or about her fighting skills other than jinchuriki abilities? We know she was kidnapped by Kumo and saved by Minato- all we saw an image of Kushina being carried in Minato's arm.

    OP counted the Mizukage and other random strong shinbies but they are just there. No story behind them.
    Keep in mind, as I'm sure you do, that Sakura's actions are dictated by Kishi. Granted, Sakura doesn't have Naruto's massive chakra/stamina or training genius, nor does she have Sasuke's Sharingan nor overall genius. However, without that, I think it's accepted that she has a shot at becoming the greatest medic ninja ever but not a complete ninja like Tsunade because of her poor combat skills.

    Sakura's an elite healer. The thing is, if you look at Naruto and Sasuke's training in Shippuden it's been about S-class moves, and I personally consider her healing abilities to be at an S-class when she does things like whip up a cure for Sasori's poison in 5 minutes when no one in the Sand can. We know for a fact that they're officially Jounin level, though overall she's a Chuunin from the fact that she was a target of the white Zetsu, who was killing only Jounin medic ninja.

    Training on other jutsu:
    She doesn't need to have spent enormous amounts of time on lot's of techniques that she could learn at a reasonable rate due to her perfect chakra release, excellent chakra balance/control, and that she's smart. The main person in front of Sakura was her. However, Tsunade being the Hokage hasn't helped. It should've instilled a sense of independence, but it seems to have made her frail and dependent, or at least maintained it My point is easily countered though given the third Hokage (while Hokage) produced the legendary Sannin.
    Summonings are a good example of a jutsu Sakura could learn in a reasonable amount of time (months) that are also powerful because of her chakra release control and intelligence. I feel this is a powerful jutsu that she could learn in a relatively short amount of time due to her perfect chakra release, all she needed was the contract and some supervision (Tsunade had enough time to work with her for 2.5-3 years, she had more). As well, if Sakura learned one technique from Kakashi , Shizune, and Kurenai, she'd be immensely well rounded. She's only 16. Naruto started off with a retarded progress compared to everyone else, yet he has surpassed nearly everyone in terms of combat and matured significantly. I see no reason, even if the manga ends, that at her young age, if Sakura wanted it, that she couldn't achieve an incredible position such as a top jounin like Gai as well as top medic.

    We know that she was taught some poisons (she developed an antidote for Sasori's poison and used Tsunade's poison against Sasuke), but it seems that she didn't expand much on this because she used one she learned from Tsunade against Sasuke rather than either a new or improved one she developed. A good student would've studied Sasori's poison much more than simply coming up with an antidote in 5 minutes (which is very impressive) and developed a better one of her own with it's own antidote.

    There are simple things she could've added like elemental affinity to her Taijutsu, she might literally have fists of fire, rock, or crazy stuff. It might've taken her a couple of months, but it's like she sheltered herself while Naruto and Sasuke were out exposing themselves to any sunlight that would pass through the clouds to get stronger, and later for Naruto to get wiser once he began studying sage mode and reflected back on Jiraiya's teachings, his inner thoughts, Jiraiya's book, etc. @Psukkar might argue that her maturity might have contributed to this, and I don't think I'd disagree, but I think there's more.

    Relatively simple things she could've learned during Shippuuden ( conservative estimate: 10+months)
    1.) Tsunade: Katusuyu and slugs (2-4 months)
    2.) Shizune: Poison cloud, needles with Sakura making an improved version of Sasori's posion (1-2) months
    3.) elemental affinity + integration with taijutsu (3-5 months)
    4.) {optional} Start genjutsu training with Kurenei (1-ongoing, pause at war, resume afterwards)

    Mei is powerful, yet we know almost nothing about her. The same can be said about Onooki, so I don't think that that's really a male/female deal. We only know about Gaara and the Raikage because of their plot involvement. If Mei and A. were switched, we'd know a hell of lot more about her. I don't know Kishi's intentions, and I can't pretend to. If he doesn't wan't female characters to be involved or succeed, then that's him. I'm just pointing out that all the ingredients are there for them to do so except for things like character flaws in Sakura's case. I think she's very talented with a great teacher, but she stopped developing and I agree with Psukkar that she hasn't turned the corner regarding maturity.

    As for Kushina, I have a feeling that she was integral to the fourth's evolution towards greatness. I think he could've been great on his own, but Kushina helped him max out his potential before his death. Yes, he's the yellow flash and is fast as hell in linear speed and with FTG (a Fuuinjutsu). However, what defined the fourth Hokage were his Fuuinjutsu, FTG included of course.
    We know for example that Kushina worked with Minato to develop, serve as a background, for the eight-trigrams seal, and I believe possibly more of his techniques. From what little I saw of her, she was remarkable and cast a shadow over almost all female character such that they're unlikely to ever step out of, and that's likely due to my bias for her and that her moment was so emotional for me both inside Naruto and during the flashback to her giving birth--fighting the Kyuubi (so interpret that as you will).

    Sakura currently lacks Tsunade's guts
    Sakura at one point had inner Sakura, the one who broke Ino's mind control. Where'd she go?

    Kushina and Tsunade have shown the ability to willingly die to for those they love readily. Generally, when you show this ability once, you've shown it multiple times before you do actually die. Recall, as Jiraiya died, he said something like, "It's not about how you live but how you die in the ninja world that defines you." Kushina needs no explanation, taking a Kyuubi tail through the chest to save baby Naruto with Minato (albeit she was dying from the extraction).

    Tsunade used up almost her entire supply of chakra (which is why she went into a coma instead of death) to heal/protect the entire village that could be from Nagato using her Mitotic Regeneration with Katsuyu as a conduit and releasing the blue yin seal, which is one of the greatest sacrifices of any of the Hokage. Tsunade embraced the mentality of the true Hokage that I'm meant to protect everyone, even if it means putting everything one the line, with no hesitation. Don't forget as well, when she was "cut to ribbons" according to Orochimaru when she protected Naruto pre-time-skip and declared herself 5th Hokage. Tsunade is easily the strongest female character, though perhaps not the strongest combat wise, in the Naruto series, and she dwarfs many of the male characters who are of equal importance in guts. Thus, even if there's only one dominant female character, Kishi has made Tsunade that one. She doesn't need to blow up islands, she needs guts, ethics, caring, enabling those like Naruto who are the future, etc.

    What Sakura needs to do, is to sacrifice herself and/or something she loves for the ones she loves regardless of the outcome and without hesitation at some point (death is not always the price). She doesn't need to learn another jutsu if she can use what she's learned and do this, sacrifice herself for the people she loves, namely: Naruto and Sasuke. Sacrifice doesn't mean to die. It does mean of course giving up something she loves, but I'm not sure what it would be yet. The main thing she still seems to have is this foolish infatuation with Sasuke.

    @Psukkar: Sorry, I suppose I just worked my way into your maturity argument somewhat.

    I get your argument, I think, so please correct me if I'm wrong. Basically the "failure" was there from the start, from the word go. In fact, there was no failure (why I used quotes above) because there was never really any goal to obtain in Kishi's eyes, just an illusion for us. Kishi never had a goal for them, but we didn't realize that. I guess that's your point? I don't think it's wrong to approach the discussion this way, i.e. a literary view. It seems some people disagree, but I haven't been able to read everything. I think you're being fair but misunderstood by some, again I haven't been able to read enough.

    You may be right, but it's such a disappointing answer that even if it's write I choose to believe that it's not, lol. It's like when Itachi talks about reality consisting of what we choose to believe and not to believe.

    Peace


    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    @Psukkar

    I agree with the latter part of your post, I think the stuff about the bloodlines and lineage are just not the her problem in anyway.


    People forget how she was at the start of the series. SHe really was despistable person to be with if your on ninja mission that could mean life or death out there. Kishi has displayed a certain type of person purpose their is no mistake here on kishi part.

    Her shortcomings come from a more simple problem and that is muturity.

    The key problem sakura has is a motivational one. She's not in the right state of mind to be a affective shinobi. Having things going for like bloodline limits or a farmous bloodline are all good and all but the growth comes from the person's motivations.

    In alot of ways she is far more naive than naruto, naruto is labelled as naive about is his idealogy BUT isn't naive on the battlefield. He knows what he has to do when it comes to fight time and just does it. Same with sasuke he has strong convictions in his actions he does what he wants and does it. Sakura simply put lacks the know how regarding the battlefield.

    And ask yourselves why is it always like this for sakura and the answer comes from the start of the series. THats right, the very beginning.

    Compare her idea of what a shinobi is to naruto and sasuke at the start of the series. Naruto and sasuke wanted to learn techniques and just simply WANT TO BECOME better. Particlular naruto just wanted to be a shinobi, Sasuke had slightly different reasons to get stronger because of itachi. But Sakura didn't want to learn new techniques or think about getting stronger. Its like she become a shinobi but didn't think the baggage of protecting your village and getting stronger came along with it. If something like this happened in reality the best describtion you would give it unprofessional.

    And once she did decide to go to tsunade to actually make something for her life, it was actually only to do with sasuke not about protecting the village. And this was eveident in the last meeting she had with sasuke.

    Although I think her recent meeting with sasuke has pointed out her shortcommings, she admitts it and whats to work hard now not just for sasuke but for the village to help protect naruto in this war. Thats frist step in solving a problem. She will get better but it maybe too late for her to be effective now when her village needs her the most.

    Nice and short, reason for sakura's shortcomings come down to her lack marturity early on in her life. It stunned her growth as a shinobi.

    I strongly agree that maturity is a major issue, and I now write about it above to an extent though perhaps not to one you intended, and one I missed. I think bloodlines have some importance by the way (I merely meant that they facilitated Tsunade's success), probably not a deciding one with Sakura, but it was on my mind at the time when I was reading posts and thinking as to what was missing, so maybe it was missing for a good reason. It was just kind of striking that Tsunade has Senju and Uzumaki bloodlines when they've become so important recently. However, the more I think about it, it's the lack of development, guts, and maturity that hold/held Sakura back, and while she's young and can still overcome them, the manga isn't and we may judge her before she ever get's that far.

    Peace
     
         
    Last edited by leafeater; 06-21-2011 at 01:34 PM.

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by leafeater View Post
    .....Peace

    Whoa! Loved your analysis. It was a great post and a lot to read- I like it. But did you really counter my post?

    I said Kishi ignored Sakura's development after a point. Secondly he meant her to be the way she is. You basically said the same thing I think- I will read it again though.

    I like Tsunade's character. In fact I like all strong female characters.lol. I find her strong but find myself defending her on NB most of the time.

    Kushina was skilled highly but what we saw was her side was as a mother and a wife and she impressed us all in that capacity.

    Kishi needs to develope his skills with female characters. I'm not saying he doesn't make any strong character at all- Mizukage is there. But he really doesn't seem to know how to develop an all round strong female shinobi character. What would motivate her properly...He makes a good fight scene so if they are fighting yeah throw in KGs and skills and you got it. But, how a girl would think- he seems to know only a few kinds.
     
         
    Last edited by Ira; 06-21-2011 at 04:01 PM.

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by isthatnecessary View Post
    Whoa! Loved your analysis. But did you really counter my post?

    I said Kishi ignored Sakura's development after a point. Secondly he meant her to be the way she is. You basically said the same thing I think- I will read it again though.

    I like Tsunade's character. In fact I like all strong female characters.lol. I find her strong but find myself defending her on NB most of the time.

    Kushina was skilled highly but what we saw was her side was as a mother and a wife and she impressed us all in that capacity.

    Kishi needs to develope his skills with female characters. I'm not saying he doesn't make any strong character at all- Mizukage is there. But he really doesn't seem to know how to develop an all round strong female shinobi character. What would motivate her properly...He makes a good fight scene so if they are fighting yeah throw in KGs and skills and you got it. But, how a girl would think- he seems to know only a few kinds.
    No, not really, honestly I sort of agreed in some ways, I did in one paragraph address it specifically as I think you're taking flak for your literary analysis being misunderstood. I'm not sure if you feel this way, but I think Kushina from what little we've seen and Tsunade without a doubt buck the trend of weak female characters and/or strong ones with little plot.

    I disagreed about Mei, hence my mention of Onooki.

    I don't know, I honestly felt like I was synthesizing all the pieces from thoughts I hadn't posted and thoughts of others into one singular idea, not just a group of ideas so that we could paint a more complete picture. I don't know if I succeeded or failed really.

    To be quite honest, I can't really counter your post as I don't know what Kishimoto's plan is/was. It's just that I see that he's made strong female characters, at least her teacher Tsunade, so he could've done so again. I don't know what he thinks so I can't say no, he thinks the opposite. Even if she had matured as a person and developed as a more complete ninja, I don't know if her role would've been much larger or better.

    I think Hinata is an example of someone who has both mature and developed, and her role grew, but only briefly. Neither she nor Naruto has pursued that bond at all it seems since that day. Hell, Naruto gave her more recognition when she gave him some balm during the Chuunin exams. Who knows...

    Peace
     
         

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Isthatnecessary, seems like you're fishing right now : - ) because now you need to define "an all around strong female shinobi".Forgot to mention Kiba's clan is run by women, so there is plenty of strong women, and you need to remember this is also a comedy so most personalities will be exaggerated(like choji getting mad when he gets called fat).Nothing proves that the choice of the main character isn't circumstantial, which leads to the fail of sakura(who is strongly assiociated with the main charater)

    Anyways, it also seems like we all sorta agree that sakura was development up to a point, and then suddenly was pushed backed to back of the room. And some say she was meant to be that way, by pointing to her lacking maturity and others like i say kishi forgot/ignored her to further develop naruto/sasuke and the villains in this story.It's a shame nonetheles.
     
         

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by leafeater View Post
    No, not really, honestly I sort of agreed in some ways, I did in one paragraph address it specifically as I think you're taking flak for your literary analysis being misunderstood. I'm not sure if you feel this way, but I think Kushina from what little we've seen and Tsunade without a doubt buck the trend of weak female characters and/or strong ones with little plot.

    I disagreed about Mei, hence my mention of Onooki.

    I don't know, I honestly felt like I was synthesizing all the pieces from thoughts I hadn't posted and thoughts of others into one singular idea, not just a group of ideas so that we could paint a more complete picture. I don't know if I succeeded or failed really.

    To be quite honest, I can't really counter your post as I don't know what Kishimoto's plan is/was. It's just that I see that he's made strong female characters, at least her teacher Tsunade, so he could've done so again. I don't know what he thinks so I can't say no, he thinks the opposite. Even if she had matured as a person and developed as a more complete ninja, I don't know if her role would've been much larger or better.

    I think Hinata is an example of someone who has both mature and developed, and her role grew, but only briefly. Neither she nor Naruto has pursued that bond at all it seems since that day. Hell, Naruto gave her more recognition when she gave him some balm during the Chuunin exams. Who knows...

    Peace
    I agree - more or less. I asked because I read your post only once by then and wanted to make sure if we were on the same page.

    Quote Originally Posted by siyo View Post
    Isthatnecessary, seems like you're fishing right now : - ) because now you need to define "an all around strong female shinobi".Forgot to mention Kiba's clan is run by women, so there is plenty of strong women, and you need to remember this is also a comedy so most personalities will be exaggerated(like choji getting mad when he gets called fat).Nothing proves that the choice of the main character isn't circumstantial, which leads to the fail of sakura(who is strongly assiociated with the main charater)

    Anyways, it also seems like we all sorta agree that sakura was development up to a point, and then suddenly was pushed backed to back of the room. And some say she was meant to be that way, by pointing to her lacking maturity and others like i say kishi forgot/ignored her to further develop naruto/sasuke and the villains in this story.It's a shame nonetheles.
    I'm not fishing for anything. KIba clan- yeah sure- exactly how did you find out that it was run by women? Kiba's father had probably left his mother as Kiba's statement seem to imply-

    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/429/7

    As for the rest you started the thread and I replied- basically gave my opnion over the matter. Isn't what you wanted- POV or other members over the issue? ~^

    If you have anything to say in reply to my analysis say it but, don't throw random accusations out. I don't need to fish.l
     
         
    Last edited by Ira; 06-21-2011 at 05:32 PM.

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    Re: What happened to Sakura? Where did Kishi fail?

    Quote Originally Posted by isthatnecessary View Post

    As for the rest you started the thread and I replied- basically gave my opnion over the matter. Isn't what you wanted- POV or other members over the issue? ~^

    Ifl
    lol i am not condemning your opinion and i actually appreciate it but i have the right to dispute it(as you do mine) .
    What i meant by fishing is you do not have solid prove of your assumption, and it seemed like it was a matter of fact (could be my mistake).

    I would like to know how you define an all around female shinobi?
     
         
    Last edited by siyo; 06-22-2011 at 01:25 PM.

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