I've heard a bunch of people on the narutobase severely underrate non edo madra saying that he would of lost to the 5 kages if he wasn't edo. or how kabuto should taked credit for his extreme powerups or how madara is a failure and a loser this thread will kill everything people have to say about madara and prove he should be top 2 or easily top 3 in everybody list even if he wasn't an edo.
1.) to the "he would of lost to the 5kages if he wasn't an edo" people 4get about this
madara was shown to be able to defeat muu and oonoki at the sametime with ease while claiming they were childs play to him
non edo madara was able to defeat 2 worthy kage level ninja with lil no effort. keep in mind this is young oonoki without back problems and even oonoki was suspicious of the fake madara.
look at the last panel on the left oonoki once again acknowledges non edo madara's power. throughout the whole naruto series it is if kishi is trying to drill into the readers head how much "invincible" or how powerful madara is
these manga facts are about non edo madara saying that he's a legend invincible powerful ideal and so on. Kishi is trying to drill it into the readers head that this guy is the real deal edo or not but it seems he did a poor job when people still doesn't give credit to madara when the dude name itself created a war.
2.) now to the people stated that kabuto gave him this powerup imma clear that up.
madara stated that kabuto didn't create this power because it was actually madara that created the power that he has and these are manga facts people. all that the manga shown was that kabuto gave madara senju dna. but check this out
how did kabuto create something that madara created for himself want more proof
so did kabuto really create madara's power I think not
3.) now to the saying oh madara is a bitter old failure. Now if you want to use that logic it has to fairly dished to everyone you cant just pick and choose who u want to use that logic on. Almost everyone in the naruto series are failures. ex
1.) naruto failed countless times to win sasuke over and sakura as well
2.) Kakashi failed to save obito and rin
3.) Minato failed to save his wife
4.) orchimaru failed to get sasuke body and gets totally own by itachi everytime they fight and failed to destroy the leaf village and failed to get tsuande to heal his arms
5.) Obito failed to save rin and destroy the village
so almost everyones fav character failed at one point put yet yall give madara a hard time when he fails. and nothing wrong to losing to the most powerful shinobi(hashirama) orchimaru would have failed obito, kakashi, naruto, sasuke, everyone whould had failed to. I hope this clear up the madara talk