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  1. #1
    Member Pulkit singh3's Avatar

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    What if Jiraya was recarniated at a time of 4th great ninja war

    Just wondering what if Jiraya was recarniated at 4th great ninja war . What do you think about his reaction on Naruto being a hero who killed pein
     
         

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    Senior Member Cfighter's Avatar

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    Re: What if Jiraya was recarniated at a time of 4th great ninja war

    I remember people really wanted Jiraya to be resurrected and for Naruto to be forced to fight him. Looking back at the war arc after all these years however... even if Jiraya was brought back Naruto would have had one of two reactions:

    Either A. Jiraya would have lost his consciousness, Naruto would have been pissed and the two would fight, but the fight would have been short and anticlimactic (as Naruto was SO MUCH more powerful than Jiraya by then).

    Or B. Jiraya pulls an Asuma and keeps his mind and there wouldn't have been much of a fight at all. It would have just been a sappy, "emotional" moment between Jiraya and Naruto until they either fought very briefly as Master and Student for the last time, or there would have been a cop out and Jiraya would have pulled an Itachi somehow and escaped Edo Tensei.

    Either scenario, I prefer Jiraya to remain dead. I hate to sound like one of those f*ags who b**tches about the war arc because "no one died" but I personally feel death is an incredibly powerful tool to a writer, and the worst thing the war arc did was negate the power of said tool by constantly bringing back characters. Jiraya's death was so important and meaningful that I feel if he was brought back for something as trivial as the war arc, his death would have lost a little of it's meaning.
     
         
    Last edited by Cfighter; 02-17-2017 at 06:06 PM.

  3. #3
    The Sage Scholar Umari Senju's Avatar

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    Re: What if Jiraya was recarniated at a time of 4th great ninja war

    Cfighter stated it perfectly. Ultimately it's best that Kishi did t Revive him. It would serve no real purpose other to add another emotional moment to the war and possibly ruin Jiraiya 'a character.
     
         

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    Konoha no Kiroi Senko YellowFang's Avatar

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    Re: What if Jiraya was recarniated at a time of 4th great ninja war

    I'd hate that with passion...

    He remains a beloved and a good character because Kishi didn't disrespected his death and brought him back to do pathetic stuff and die again.
     
         

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    Senior Member ninjarasengan's Avatar

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    Re: What if Jiraya was recarniated at a time of 4th great ninja war

    Quote Originally Posted by Cfighter View Post
    I remember people really wanted Jiraya to be resurrected and for Naruto to be forced to fight him. Looking back at the war arc after all these years however... even if Jiraya was brought back Naruto would have had one of two reactions:

    Either A. Jiraya would have lost his consciousness, Naruto would have been pissed and the two would fight, but the fight would have been short and anticlimactic (as Naruto was SO MUCH more powerful than Jiraya by then).

    Or B. Jiraya pulls an Asuma and keeps his mind and there wouldn't have been much of a fight at all. It would have just been a sappy, "emotional" moment between Jiraya and Naruto until they either fought very briefly as Master and Student for the last time, or there would have been a cop out and Jiraya would have pulled an Itachi somehow and escaped Edo Tensei.

    Either scenario, I prefer Jiraya to remain dead. I hate to sound like one of those f*ags who b**tches about the war arc because "no one died" but I personally feel death is an incredibly powerful tool to a writer, and the worst thing the war arc did was negate the power of said tool by constantly bringing back characters. Jiraya's death was so important and meaningful that I feel if he was brought back for something as trivial as the war arc, his death would have lost a little of it's meaning.
    people use that as an excuse to complain...although, it's a lie...no one is actually revived through edotensei. It doesn't 'cheapen death' it makes death worse because you could become someones slave.
     
         

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    Senior Member Amenotejikara's Avatar

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    Re: What if Jiraya was recarniated at a time of 4th great ninja war

    Quote Originally Posted by ninjarasengan View Post
    people use that as an excuse to complain...although, it's a lie...no one is actually revived through edotensei. It doesn't 'cheapen death' it makes death worse because you could become someones slave.
    From the characters POV it's worst than death but from the reader's perspective it's cheap. If someone died and came back, the feelings won't be as strong as it initially were when they first died. Thou I'm sure if a better writer handled the arc it might work, kishi somewhat pulled it off with edo itachi and minato but not by much. maybe his goal was to keep his fans from being depressed but instead relieved which is likely i guess.
     
         
    Last edited by Amenotejikara; 02-17-2017 at 11:03 PM.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Cfighter's Avatar

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    Re: What if Jiraya was recarniated at a time of 4th great ninja war

    Quote Originally Posted by ninjarasengan View Post
    people use that as an excuse to complain...although, it's a lie...no one is actually revived through edotensei. It doesn't 'cheapen death' it makes death worse because you could become someones slave.
    Quote Originally Posted by Amenotejikara View Post
    From the characters POV it's worst than death but from the reader's perspective it's cheap. If someone died and came back, the feelings won't be as strong as it initially were when they first died. Thou I'm sure if a better writer handled the arc it might work, kishi somewhat pulled it off with edo itachi and minato maybe his goal was to keep his fans from being depressed but instead relieved which is likely i guess.
    ^ He gets it.

    Death is a very tricky thing when it comes to any form of fiction. Whether it comes to literature, comics, film, television, etc. If you abuse Death and kill off characters, Death as a tool will loose it's significance. Likewise if you never utilize Death as a tool, nothing negative will become of that story however there may be a lot of missed opportunities to give a character a much larger purpose that can only be achieved through Death. It's a give-take relationship when you decide to utilize the power of Death in a story. When used properly, characters who may not have had much development prior can suddenly be some of the most developed characters in the story if their death becomes symbolic or otherwise means something significant to the story.

    For example: A great use of Death is in Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows (the book). More specifically: Snape's death. Snape throughout the Harry Potter books up until the Deathly Hallows really wasn't a very well developed character. Now before Harry Potter fans start putting me up to hang, let me explain - Snape was a great character but had little character development. We were given just enough information about Snape's backstory to either sympathize with him or hate him. However when Snape died, he was given some of the most wonderful, enlightening, gripping character development arguably in any of the Harry Potter books. The information learned about his character completely changed how people perceived him. You may be tempted to counter my point however by claiming this wasn't tied directly to his death - but that is incorrect. It was because of his death that we learned so much more about who he was and what lengths he would go to for the one he loved. That is a great use of Death.

    Now on the flip side, for an example of the abuse of Death: Honestly, just think of any slasher/horror movie. It's a bit of a cop out on my end for not referencing a specific story for an example of how not to use Death as a tool, but to be honest I'm in a bit of a time crunch right now so this is the best I can give at the moment. In a typical slasher/horror movie, usually nearly every character dies. You could make an argument for that being the point, but nonetheless it diminishes the impact of a character death when you go into a story knowing and expecting everyone to die. Again, in some cases this can also be used cleverly enough and Death can be impactful, but I think you get the idea.

    Now, going back to Naruto.

    A great use of Death: Jiraya. His death was the single most impactful moment in the entire series - there's little debating that. Not only could you make the argument that it was Jiraya's death that began the 4th ninja war, but his death symbolized so much and it was only because of Jiraya's death that Naruto grew as a character himself. Had Jiraya been revived, the other guy had it right; for Naruto as a character it probably would have had a slight effect on him. But to us, the reader, Jiraya's legacy and emotional impact of his death would never be the same on repeat viewings knowing that he would be revived once again to tie loose ends. Loose ends that were very significant to both Naruto and Tsunade.

    The counter for this can also be said for everyone revived during the 4th war. Even if they were characters we had never been introduced to prior (such as Sai's brother) - it was a very cheap and easy way to force character interactions and force character development. No exchange between an Edo Tensei and the person who they impacted was nearly as important as when they were alive. Another example is Itachi and Sasuke. Sure, Itachi got to say goodbye to Sasuke and they had that closure -- but the whole point and the entire significance in Itachi's death was that Sasuke didn't get that closure. It added to his struggle and frustration. It added a new layer to his wicked way of thinking.
     
         

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    Member thgt89's Avatar

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    Re: What if Jiraya was recarniated at a time of 4th great ninja war

    It's a great thing he was not brought back in the war. He would have just been ruined like Minato and Itachi when they came back.
     
         

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